Blackout build up. [Archive]

blackoutsteve

26-04-2009, 07:14 PM

It seems most of you guys have threads on your build ups, so I guess I better join in on the fun.:p
It's a long story going back to 1992 when I bought the car.. I guess that's where I'll start, and bring it up to speed over the next few weeks..

1992. This is the basket case I bought. The only 1969 Camaro I had been able to find and was in the Trading Post as an unfinished project. (7s & 8s were evrywhere it seemed, but I much prefer 9s even if the dash is a b!tch to convert.)

http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/2584/assembly0488qm.jpg

The steering conversion was just plain wrong, the dash was a total mess, the firewall was a hack-job, the 454 dropped a valve after about 1000 miles, the th350 was scrapped within, and there was more filler in it that you could imagine.. I had no idea what I was about to get myself into. I paid a tad over $10K for it back then.:rolleyes:

http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/7733/assembly0512sl.jpg

http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/5400/assembly0500dn.jpg

The huge amount of things wrong with this car is why I'm more the purist and not a fan of modifications. Rarely I see good ones.
So, my goal with the steering conversion on this car was naturally to make it look as though GM made this Camaro a factory RHD. But that's a long while later..

I was recently able to get in touch with the previous owner in California from details on the pink-slip. She told me she had "adopted" the Camaro after it had been stolen, and was found in a paddock with no transmission. She sent me a pic, circa 1983 after she got it running and was driving it for a couple of years. She had named it "Maybe". :D

http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/3355/copyofmaybe1983.jpg

Not the original green either. The original was Frost Green which is a lighter metallic green.
This is an example of the original Frost Green.
http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/7679/frostgreen.th.jpg (http://img249.imageshack.us/my.php?image=frostgreen.jpg) Yep, I prefer Tuxedo Black. ;)

tonner

26-04-2009, 07:21 PM

Awsome Steve. I like to here the story behind the build, good luck.

Greg

tuffss

26-04-2009, 07:46 PM

G'day Steve
I never knew you actually bought that car that way, she certainly has got some history behind her & plenty more to come.
Mick.

AUSCAMARO

26-04-2009, 10:55 PM

Be nice to be able to pick one of these up for $10g's nowa days!!

Looking forward to reading the whole story Steve.

Mitch

cluxford

27-04-2009, 11:57 AM

Steve awesome story I love the history of these cars. We need a look at some latest and greatest pics of your car we haven't seen too many yet

EAT-30T

27-04-2009, 02:54 PM

WOW... that's cool that you tracked the owner down. :) we had to try and track down the previous owners of my one cos I needed to obtain a title for it and perform a lien sale :( ... Both previous owners were deceased.

Twisted67

27-04-2009, 07:46 PM

Isnt There A Site In The Us That You Can Put Your Vin Into And You Can Trace The History Of The Car??????

Great Story By The Way Steve!!!

blackoutsteve

27-04-2009, 07:47 PM

Tracking down Corina, who was the last US owner, was quite easy for me.. Like I said, I have all her name and address on the pink-slip.
However, because she doesn't live there anymore, I was lucky that her name and suburb came up in a Yahoo! internet search.
She has her own website dedicated to native Americans Indians (because she is partly Cherokee I think).
Anyway, she is great to talk to and was really flipped out to learn her old Camaro was being looked after here in Australia and under-going restoration.

"Maybe" was bought from Corina on the 4th of June 1989 for just US$1350 by Kosta Skliros of Wantirna here in Melbourne.. (Does that name ring a bell?)
Also, if any of you know Con Manzaris, (think Street Rod registration) he imported the car from California.

blackoutsteve

27-04-2009, 07:48 PM

Isnt There A Site In The Us That You Can Put Your Vin Into And You Can Trace The History Of The Car??????

Great Story By The Way Steve!!!

Thanks!

Only for Canadian-sold cars to the best of my knowledge..

WILD68

27-04-2009, 07:50 PM

Great story Steve,
was wondering when you where gonna put some pics up.. oh yeah cheers for the tip of just snipe on e-bay, worked a treat n got my mate a set of gonzo's for his torana:D

blackoutsteve

28-04-2009, 10:03 PM

Plain Janes are kinda cool. If this was a genuine SS 396/L78 or something collectable and worth good money, I would have returned the car to LHD. In fact, it would have been much easier.
So, being a no-options car, I haven't felt worried about the modifications required to do the steering conversion.
On the other-hand, the idea of cutting for wheel tubs simply makes me cringe.

The trim tag shows that it was a V8 (327) (and floorpan shows it was a floorshift auto -with console) from the Van Nuys plant in Los Angeles.
Medium green standard interior, Frost Green paint (no vinyl roof) and built during the 3rd week of November 1968.
The "L492" is just a Fisher sequencing code or something and doesn't relate to any options on the car.(You may also note there are no "X codes" either. X-codes are only on Norwood, Ohio built Camaros built from Dec68.)

No other options can be confirmed except the car came with the larger 1-1/8" diamater drag link, which makes me feel it had power steering. Both big & small block cars are found with this diameter link.
Drum brakes for sure and I expect that they were manual.
It's also a pity the firewall was so cut up by the time I showed up, because they offer quite a few clues. See UPC0-A9 of your factory assembly manuals! ;)

http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/524/copyofblackoutstrimtag.jpg

Some bone-head (me:rolleyes:) ruined the trim tag in a careless attempt to drill out the rivets that held it in place. I decided that I didn't want to use this tag on my resto, and that I would do the unthinkable according to the purists of the hobby...

Have a new tag made.:eek:

...now with Tuxedo Black paint code and standard black interior.:cool:
http://img243.imageshack.us/img243/4607/trimtag007qc6.jpg

What the hell. It's just a plain Jane and I'm obviously not hiding the fact that I did it by showing everyone on an internet forum. I'm just having some fun.:)

Neat huh? ..BUT IT'S A FAKE!! :p
http://img511.imageshack.us/img511/8264/trimtag011gv7.jpg

J.J.

29-04-2009, 11:56 AM

wheel tubs make me think 315 rubber, YES PLEASE!!

Dicko

29-04-2009, 12:43 PM

Some bone-head (me:rolleyes:) ruined the trim tag in a careless attempt to drill out the rivets that held it in place. I decided that I didn't want to use this tag on my resto, and that I would do the unthinkable according to the purists of the hobby...

Have a new tag made.:eek:

I don't see a problem with that, it's not like you're making it out to be something it isn't as you have the original damaged tags. Tell them to take a long walk off a short plank. :)

cluxford

29-04-2009, 01:36 PM

Love the new tag isn't that what restomod means....

There is a time and place for the purist view but it ain't here

blackoutsteve

29-04-2009, 08:32 PM

I did change the paint and trim codes on the new tag..
I fully understand why the "purists" get pissed off about it, and I'm really on their side..
Because there are people selling fraudulant rare-optioned Camaros and getting away with it.. But in my case, I'm not frauding anything when I'm completely open and am telling everyone exactly what I've done.

Anyway. GM did such a sh!thouse job at documenting their cars back then. It's no wonder the frauds are everywhere. That pisses me off too.

cluxford

30-04-2009, 03:14 AM

Yep, try getting any sort of actual info on a 68. Even the tags are a waste of time. 69's a bit better, but still well short of great.

All good, more pics please !!!

Nev68

30-04-2009, 02:46 PM

[Steve,
You've certainly showed some commitment on your car.
Very interested in how you did the tags.
Do you have the stamp/punches?

Nev

TUFF68

30-04-2009, 04:28 PM

Very interesting story and pics of your car Steve. Only wish i knew a bit of history about my car's and their previous owners

blackoutsteve

30-04-2009, 07:40 PM

I bought the tag off A G Backeast http://www.datatags.com/
Pretty pricey, but if you need it or you just want it and have to have it.. ;)

blackoutsteve

30-04-2009, 08:38 PM

Being very naive and not exactly knowing what or how to get the Camaro up & running, I had a mate of a mate who did conversions complete the assembly, finish off the wiring and dash and so on.. That was about 1993/4.
The 454 that was supposed to be a fresh rebuild, dropped a valve, but luckily the TRW forged piston stayed in one piece and was good enough to be used again.
So, I pulled the motor and bought new Edelbrock heads, a 4 bolt main block, LS7 rods, and a steel crank. (Deep down I was busting to build me a big block.)

Here is a pic I took when checking piston to valve clearance.. I remeber having to get the piston valve reliefs flycut AND running the cam retarded 2 degrees to get the 0.080" minimum. The cam wasn't that big, I should have got ROSS to make me pistons then instead of later.

http://img513.imageshack.us/img513/6482/checkingpistonvalvesml.jpg

This is how the engine bay looked after the rebuild and before the resto.
Back then I loved it, but now I don't.. Too much black.
(Gotta love that Mustang "Caution Fan" decal.:rolleyes: )

http://img487.imageshack.us/img487/4575/knight17hv.jpg

That thing in front of the MSD is a Detroit Diesel heat exchanger. I use my coolant to control my engine oil temperature. Works brilliantly.

..and here's me thinking I'm some sort of God.. :p (Circa 1996)

http://img91.imageshack.us/img91/9889/blackoutwithproudowners.jpg

Damn, I wish I never sold that genuine SS hood!:(

blackoutsteve

30-04-2009, 08:49 PM

Just found an older engine bay pic..

http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/2951/oldenginebay2sml.jpg

Moroso low air cleaner and foam filter.. I was amazed at how much lower the original GM air cleaner bases are.
Note the SS hood in this pic and Ford XA/XB master and booster.

This intake was a Weiand "Action Plus" and a 780vac.
I remember swapping to an 850DP and a Victor Jnr and squealing the tires through high gear. :D
I was so conservative thinking that a dual plane and vac secondaries was the way to go.. WRONG! :p

J.J.

01-05-2009, 12:27 PM

man you know your stuff

blackoutsteve

01-05-2009, 08:31 PM

I started the resto in 2002. I was only supposed to fix a few things like the dash ducting, and improve the subframe conversion, but as you all know, one thing lead to another and before i knew it, the Camaro was spinning on a rotisserie.:p

First up was to improve the subframe conversion which I felt was beyond improving.. So, I returned it to LHD using some doner parts and sold it.
The new subframe just happened to be in an online mate's backyard in Arizona.
My good friend Jim delivered it for me for free to Ventura CA so Pete could bring it here.. (Yes, I insisted on slinging him some cashola for his troubles)
Here it is in Ventura, waiting to be loaded into the container.
http://img274.imageshack.us/img274/3671/atmarina9ht.jpg

I knew it was slightly bent, but only out by about a 1/4" or so on the front "horns". Diagonals were pretty good, but some tweeking was required.
No biggy.. I bolted it and the crane to the floor and used a pully to tension the frame in the direction I wanted it to move, then a few taps with Sister Sledge.. I used a cable ratchet to pull the frame so it's diagonal measurements are now within 1/4".
Looks brutal, but it did the trick nicely.
http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/4080/straighteningsubframe00.jpg

http://img78.imageshack.us/img78/4080/straighteningsubframe00.jpg

I made a jig for the subframe to do the conversion on using the factory dimensions and a very straight, borrowed subframe. Forget plumb-bobs and spirit levels! A jig will allow me to transfer holes from oneside to the other with plenty of accuracy.
http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/5721/69subframesettingupjig0.jpg

This pic shows the steering box section (cut from a bent Australian delivery Pontiac Parisienne subframe) being located (very accurately) on the right side.
http://img113.imageshack.us/img113/1937/subframeconversion0109dw.jpg

An almost finished top view..
http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/203/subframeconversion0383yu.jpg

..side views.
http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/6049/subframeconversion0395br.jpg

http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/3739/subframeconversion0371hl.jpg

Home from the blasters..
http://img274.imageshack.us/img274/3160/rotisserie0464fw.jpg

..and primer, ready for paint..
http://img274.imageshack.us/img274/284/rotisserie0489bb.jpg

http://img274.imageshack.us/img274/8020/rotisserie0502mq.jpg

AUSCAMARO

01-05-2009, 09:12 PM

Very nice work Steve... Very neat indeed.

RSZ28

02-05-2009, 10:22 AM

Steve mate. That work is absolutely bewdiful!

Major investment in building up the jig, but fantastic result.

Are you a toolmaker by trade?

And mate the pic with you from 96! Well if you were smart enough to invest in a 69 way back then, you almost are god LOL!

Cheers !

blackoutsteve

02-05-2009, 07:32 PM

Tool maker? No, but thank you very much indeed. ;) I went to a tech school, and that's about it..

There are also a heap more pics of getting the subframe converted that I intend on posting real soon..
But right now, I'm about to order pizza! :D

blackoutsteve

02-05-2009, 11:37 PM

Because the subframe was out of a 67 (Camaro or Firebird), the bumpstops were different.
http://img124.imageshack.us/img124/5223/67bumper.jpg

I didn't have any 69-74 doners at that time so I contacted a yard in the US and they cut a pair off a Nova subframe and sent them to me.
I unpicked the 67s and welded on the 69s.
http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/7678/novabumpstops7ka.jpg

http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/5849/stopsunpicked1ni.jpg

http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/873/readytoweld0en.jpg

Look at that messy welding.. Just like OE! :D
http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/61/lhstopdone8ns.jpg

This also means I have two 67 bump stops for sale. Yes, they will require welding! ;)
http://img242.imageshack.us/img242/2518/67controlarmstopsyi8.th.jpg (http://img242.imageshack.us/my.php?image=67controlarmstopsyi8.jpg)

blackoutsteve

03-05-2009, 12:10 AM

The function of the subframe was obviously very important, but to me, so was the look.
I wanted it to look as though this was a factory right hand drive subframe. So, a lot of work (a lot of work!) went into the "cosmetic side" of the conversion too.

http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/2027/subframeconversion012.jpg

Crush tubes were installed within, and a 1/8" plate was tacked in place. A reasonable amount of heat was added to the plate with a rose-bud tip and then quickly, a bolt, nut and washers were fitted and tightened until they seated against the crush tubes.
http://img110.imageshack.us/img110/4930/formingboltheadrecess.jpg

http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/3803/boltheadrecessesdone.jpg

http://img685.imageshack.us/img685/9354/outerskinandboxinplace.jpg

http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/1624/leftrailasoriginal.jpg

http://img115.imageshack.us/img115/1172/itssteeringboxready.jpg

RSZ28

03-05-2009, 08:23 PM

Brilliant stuff Steve. Awesome attention to detail there mate! Kudos to you! :)

camaro_1967rs

04-05-2009, 11:56 PM

So, a lot of work (a lot of work!) went into the "cosmetic side" of the conversion too.

http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/2027/subframeconversion012.jpg

Great job you are nearly tempting me to organise a conversion for mine, but it would have to be of equal std..

just a question, what do you do Steve for a living I noticed the Sika Products.

EAT-30T

05-05-2009, 12:35 AM

That's bloody unreal mate... truly..

blackoutsteve

05-05-2009, 06:52 AM

Thanks guys.. More to come..:)

just a question, what do you do Steve for a living I noticed the Sika Products.
I do a lot of caulking of precast & insitu as well as concrete patching/repairs.. I used to caulk full-time, but am just labouring at the moment doing a little bit of everything
What do you do? Do you use Sika?

RSZ28

05-05-2009, 08:17 AM

blackoutsteve

05-05-2009, 07:06 PM

Sika stuff through Bursons or whoever is a rip off. Good stuff, just deadly on price.
I use 3M on the Camaro.

camaro_1967rs

05-05-2009, 08:59 PM

Thanks guys.. More to come..:)

I do a lot of caulking of precast & insitu as well as concrete patching/repairs.. I used to caulk full-time, but am just labouring at the moment doing a little bit of everything
What do you do? Do you use Sika?

Steve when you get a chance if you are looking for work, then I occassionaly use people that cork. My business sells and installs Bamboo flooring at the premium end of the market, finish is important.

Our group of stores are one of the largest users of sika t55 t53 adhesive products

Paul
0433 645 777

camaro_1967rs

05-05-2009, 09:03 PM

Sika stuff through Bursons or whoever is a rip off. Good stuff, just deadly on price.
I use 3M on the Camaro.

I forgot to add, if you want sika products i should be able to do a good price you and others on this site, as long as its purchased by carton.

what products do you use for the car side of things?

blackoutsteve

05-05-2009, 09:43 PM

Thanks a heap Paul.. ;)
On the Camaro, I have used 3M seam sealer for the firewall and caulk sold in bead from www.amkproducts.com for stuff like inner door splash sheilds and fasteners through firewalls & such.

http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/3450/firewallmarkings048.th.jpg (http://img213.imageshack.us/my.php?image=firewallmarkings048.jpg) http://img119.imageshack.us/img119/3936/transloop001.th.jpg (http://img119.imageshack.us/my.php?image=transloop001.jpg)

I buy the 3M sealer from GMH.

blackoutsteve

07-05-2009, 09:35 PM

The firewall was done before the subframe. I had a firewall done for it ages ago by a panel shop, but when I dismanted the car, I found rust bubbles in the seam from where they left metal exposed. Geez! :mad:
(Note to self: Don't pay some idiot to do what you can do better yourself.)

In order to totally redo the dash-abortion, I bought a complete bulkhead shell of a smashed up 69 Camaro out the US. The original firewall was very good for detail, information and a few doner parts too. :)

http://img113.imageshack.us/img113/9241/bulkheaddoner018al.jpg

A lot of the work was done before I got a camera, so there's not as much to show during the early stages..
Naturally, I wanted a factory-looking firewall. Not a fan of bland flat firewalls, a factory looking firewall was a much bigger challenge and much better looking in my opnion. It also accomodates things that belong in engine bays too.

Firstly, I robbed the bulkhead of the center creased section and fitted it.

http://img374.imageshack.us/img374/9308/fwallwelding5.jpg

In this pic, you can also see that the recess for the park brake cable has been swapped over, and the return of the "X" where air from the heater used to pass through.
http://img374.imageshack.us/img374/495/centerinstalledsml.jpg

The next step was to form a piece of sheet for where the column and brake booster pass through/mount. This is probably my 2nd or 3rd attempt. I had never done it before and was giving myself a crash-course in sheet metal working.
Checking for fit with exhaust and the original subframe.
http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/5700/driverssidesofarsml.jpg

I used an original piece (turned over) for where the column passes through.
http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/9418/steveworking2.jpg

..and (mostly) welded in place. :)
http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/6287/driverssideinstalled2sm.jpg

The other side simply got a piece of flat sheet as it will be covered by the heater cover.
I had a RHD fibreglass heaterbox, that I just wasn't happy with. I pondered for hours over a LHD cover wondering how to convert it until I realised I just had to build one from scratch....

blackoutsteve

07-05-2009, 09:54 PM

Got an old dinosaur Swage & Jenny. Very handy to form the caulk-bead-recess in the heater cover.
http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/6272/heatercover0232tx.jpg

http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/1840/heatercover0218qb.jpg

Trace around an original LHD cover..
http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/2126/heatercover0364cn.jpg

Roll the bead..
http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/2008/heatercover0406wk.jpg

Lip the edges with hammer, chisel and my trusty train-track-anvil.

http://img130.imageshack.us/img130/9351/heatercover0420sd.jpg

http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/6730/heatercover8ta.jpg

Attach the side..
http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/4345/heatercover0489hy.jpg

http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/6743/heatercover0546ss.jpg

Make the top.. (Easy.. -just a few folds. ;) )
http://img86.imageshack.us/img86/6721/heatercover0575uo.jpg

Trim the sides (be careful!) http://img86.imageshack.us/img86/4490/heatercover0606zy.th.jpg (http://img86.imageshack.us/my.php?image=heatercover0606zy.jpg)
..and attach the top.
http://img86.imageshack.us/img86/9256/heatercover0586fo.jpg

Neat huh? :)
http://img86.imageshack.us/img86/5274/heatercover0623hy.jpg

http://img93.imageshack.us/img93/9347/heatercover0743ht.jpg

blackoutsteve

07-05-2009, 10:14 PM

3M seam sealer, applied messy, just like the factory!
Also, crayon markings for pure wank-value.:p You may have seen restorations with white crayon written on top of the firewall paint.. This is wrong. The worker would write certain options on the firewall BEFORE it was painted. The crayon marks would then show under the paint, which didn't matter to GM..
After all, it's just an engine bay..
http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/7568/firewallmarkings0439hy.jpg

The options I have are "Tux" for Tuxedo Black. "N10" for dual exhaust. "D80" for front & rear spoiler. "M35" for Powerglide. "OK" which was often written there and some other typical crapola..
Like I said.. pure wank-value and just for fun. :)
..and in case you're wondering, no "PTB" because that was only a Norwood thing. LA cars never had those stamps.

Needless to say, I'm quite pleased with the result because it simply looks factory original. ..but RHD. :D
http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/9318/heatercover090lc6.jpg

..OK, so there's a System 1 filter there!!

WILD68

07-05-2009, 10:20 PM

Geez Steve.. you do alright hey.. im impressed, you must have some patience.:D

WILD68

07-05-2009, 10:22 PM

How much crap do you find in your system 1 filter?

blackoutsteve

07-05-2009, 10:27 PM

I forgot to say.. ..and RHD drivers will appreciate this..
You don't have to be tall to realize that there's not much leg room in the passenger floor once the pedals have been installed there..
So I added and extra 2". It accomodates the pedals well, and from the outside, it's not noticable at all. ;)

http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/6854/floorpanextension01sml.jpg

blackoutsteve

07-05-2009, 10:30 PM

How much crap do you find in your system 1 filter?

Enough to scare me.. :p
You'd be surprised at how much crud is normal..

Awesome filters though.. It you read them properly, you can get on top of a problem well before it becomes one, and they're a good learning tool -as silly as it may sound.

WILD68

07-05-2009, 10:33 PM

Enough to scare me.. :p
You'd be surprised at how much crud is normal..

Awesome filters though.. It you read them properly, you can get on top of a problem well before it becomes one, and they're a good learning tool -as silly as it may sound.

I agree some of my mates see whats in my filter that is normal and cant believe it, they just dont cut their paper filters up and inspect " what they dont know wont hurt em"...

Your dead right about learning cos you can tell exactly the source of the impending failure.

Great filters worth the every cent, (180 bucks i think)

RSZ28

08-05-2009, 08:31 AM

TUFF68

08-05-2009, 11:24 AM

Very handy work there Steve, you should be mass producing those right hand drive heater box's and flogging them on Ebay :D

and what's a chevy guy doing wearing a Mopar shirt ;)

blackoutsteve

08-05-2009, 06:44 PM

I hadn't posted on Camaros.net.. Maybe one day..
I have thought about making the heater covers.. Perhaps making one and fibreglass moulding off of it perhaps.. There's a lot of time in making the one I have, so to mass produce them in steel would probably mean I have to sell them for $500 each or some crazy figure..

The Mopar T-shirt.. Don't worry, it's soaking up oil now. ;)

blackoutsteve

08-05-2009, 07:48 PM

The dash conversion is still a work in progress.. All the steel is done, but the instrument carrier is taking a little while longer and I haven't finished iit yet. (I keep pushing it aside because it's so damn tedious to work on.:rolleyes: )

First I needed dash brackets, and duplucated both the left & right hand brackets that support the dash. They are different from each other, so I couldn't simply transplant them from my doner bulkhead and weld them in place..
Once again. most of this was pre-camera, so I didn't capture too much of "the making" unfortunately.
This is an original LH dash mount bracket..
http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/5509/originaldriversdashmoun.jpg

..and here is the one I made for the RH side. It looks simple, but it took me about four attempts to get it right..
http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/866/myacerhdashmountsml.jpg

Actually, what came out of my dash conversion is pretty interesting too, yet nothing short of pathetic.
The brake pedal box.. In the middle is a standard LHD pedal box. To the right, you will see the RHD one that I made.. ..and those two hunks of sh!t on left, they are what some F/wit did in order to mount the brake pedal & steering wheel. There is no wonder why the firewall moved when I stood on the brake and I can only hope that the rumor of the guy who performed this "conversion" was murdered is true..
Oh, please let it be true!
http://img22.imageshack.us/img22/834/pedalboxes01sml.jpg

http://img22.imageshack.us/img22/5118/pedalboxes02sml.jpg

This is the only piece I didn't make.. I had a local company make three pieces of the dash for me (before I had any idea how simple it is) and this is the only piece I used because the others just weren't good enough. (Remember note to self.. :rolleyes:) The vent surround shape/form was crap, so I sectioned the original and welded it in myself..
http://img61.imageshack.us/img61/6835/passsideventsml.jpg

This wasn't hard either providing you study everything and take loads of notes before disassembly. A lot of subtle shapes will catch you out if you're not careful.
http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/4720/glovebpoxashtraypanelsm.jpg

Old verses new dash brace. You can guess which one is now scrap metal.
http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/1328/myefforttopmoroneffortb.jpg

Unless you know what behind the instrument carrier of a LHD Camaro looks like, this pic won't mean much., But this is exactly how the steering wheel braces are mounted, but now on the right.;) (Obvioulsy taken before the new dash panel was fitted.)
http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/6431/mockupwithcolumn1sml.jpg

http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/6418/mockupwithcolumn2sml.jpg

..and fitting. You need to be really careful, because what is all nice and level, actually appears to be going down hill. I had to put the trim on to make sure that the dash wasn't sloping down toward the center of the car.
http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/8577/dashconversion007a.jpg

Well it's a long way from being finished, but I think it looks good so far..:)
http://img95.imageshack.us/img95/9619/mbrghmay0689pr.jpg

..and the Vintage Air fits nice (with a few modifications) :D
http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/4999/accelerator007bw9.jpg

tuffss

08-05-2009, 08:41 PM

G'day Steve
This amount of work performed is a real credit to you, can't wait to see the finished product.
Cheers Mick.

camaro_1967rs

08-05-2009, 08:44 PM

Steve I still have my mouth open :eek: your skills are very impressive those that I dream of having. Keep up the good work.

Your quality is why I have never converted my 67 to RHD because talk is cheap when it comes to most people to do with conversions, its just simpler to leave LHD as the last thing I can afford is someone *&cking up my car.

1969camaro

08-05-2009, 11:23 PM

Fantastic work Steve. All the pics will be a great help when I start my conversion.

blackoutsteve

10-05-2009, 06:53 PM

I needed to make a splash shield bracket for the now-driver's side.. This splash shield goes fairly un-noticed, but it's role is to keep water away from the wiring loom's bulkhead connector.

I didn't have one of these brackets, (or ever seen one before) so I called Shane and he had one to loan me so I could copy it.. :)
http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/9140/splashsheild001.jpg

http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/2938/splashsheild003.jpg

Funny thing is that I copied it exactly -not knowing it had a bend in it, and wondered why the hell it didn't sit right once fitted, until someone on Camaros.net showed me a pic of theirs. Aha damn it!:D
http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/7166/splashsheild010.jpg

So, I straightened it out (and Shane's) and fitted it.
http://img366.imageshack.us/img366/4105/splashsheild011.jpg

Obviously the clips aren't available in reverse, so I made one of those too. ;)
http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/1001/splashsheild002.jpg

blackoutsteve

10-05-2009, 07:40 PM

Doing the brakes was fun.. Not just bending up the lines, but making reverse brackets too.
This is the bracket that mounts on the subframe below the booster, and my attempt to copy it..
http://img381.imageshack.us/img381/8745/brakebrktstuffup21la.jpg

http://img381.imageshack.us/img381/1706/brakebrktstuffup47ny.jpg

http://img381.imageshack.us/img381/899/brakebrktstuffup62ja.jpg

Until I realized at this point, that the base still needs to be identical to the original..
http://img381.imageshack.us/img381/7959/brakebrktstuffup8qy.jpg

Take 2.. Although the base did need a subtle change to "clock it" slightly compared to the original, which you can see.
http://img352.imageshack.us/img352/715/assembly0296gc.jpg

Zinc plated and in action!
http://img219.imageshack.us/img219/5451/misc003.jpg

Other brackets that mount on the booster for the metering valve and proportioning valve were made in reverse too.
Mine's on the left with the new zinc dichromate.
http://img162.imageshack.us/img162/5417/originalonright.jpg

http://img162.imageshack.us/img162/7856/originalinhand.jpg

http://img509.imageshack.us/img509/5592/boostercomplete.jpg

Making up the lines was fun. Seriously. These were made while the car was at the panel shop, which is why the booster is mounted on the board to replicate it's position on the firewall..
Sorry, forgot to take more in-between pictures! :p
http://img224.imageshack.us/img224/5224/assembly078.jpg

http://img224.imageshack.us/img224/8163/assembly083.jpg

And once the car returned from panel shop jail, brake lines were fitted to the body. You have no idea how invaluable a rotisserie is when you're doing stuff like this.;)
http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/2808/assembly088.jpg

http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/142/assembly091.jpg

Anyway, I bled the system with a weed pressure sprayer which is a heap easier than two people pumping the pedal. Especially if you have a metering valve.
http://img85.imageshack.us/img85/8039/brakes009nw0.jpg

http://img85.imageshack.us/img85/5452/brakes010ga7.jpg

Yay! The car stops under it's own power.. It just needs to go under it's own power now..

RSZ28

11-05-2009, 08:32 AM

Again great work Steve. Where did you get the coil spring brake line protectors?

blackoutsteve

11-05-2009, 08:45 AM

Classic sell the stuff. I'm sure NPD, Rick's and many others do too in 3/16" & 1/4".
I had to get the 1/2" stuff for my fuel line made locally. Pics to come..:)

cluxford

11-05-2009, 10:03 AM

Steve, fantastic skills, must be pretty proud to know your pride and joy has so many hand built parts in it

67cammy

11-05-2009, 10:18 AM

Steve you are a FREAK!! (I mean that in a good way). Its quite incredible what you can do and the knowledge that you have at the age that you are. Excellent work. Well done

blackoutsteve

11-05-2009, 01:32 PM

Thanks a heap, but something tells me you don't know how old I am.. :)

EAT-30T

11-05-2009, 02:05 PM

I'm going to ban this guy cos his making us all look so bad.... lol J/K

Steve... I love your work.. I like your "do it right or don't do it at all" approach!

:)

blackoutsteve

11-05-2009, 08:17 PM

Thanks guys.. Glad you like.. :)

This is hard to keep in chronological order.. I know i've skip[ed a few steps which I'll have to come back to, but anyway.. Here's the fuel tank, pump & line install.

If there is one thing I absolutely HATE doing.. It's drilling holes in perfectly good sheet metal. So, I always look for existing (factory) holes or other items to use as support.
Mounting the electric fuel pump was a bit of a pain. I wanted to mount it directly infront of the tank, but I knew the exhaust system would need that room. I also wanted to hang the inlet ports a tad below the bottom of the tank in order to provide fuel syphoning or self-priming as per Holley's install recomendation.
The only place I could see was just in front of the axle, using the RH OE exhaust hanger as a means of support. Well, not the actual hanger itself, but the fasteners it also uses. I just had to make a bracket..
Some of the simplest things can really throw you.. It took about 3 or 4 cardboard templates to get it right.
http://img376.imageshack.us/img376/4015/assembly102.jpg

Using all OE period and GM correct fasteners of course. :p
http://img231.imageshack.us/img231/6742/assembly1105xm.jpg

This is where it hangs in relation to the wheel well. Front of car -->
http://img231.imageshack.us/img231/9656/assembly1047yd.jpg

http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/1424/assembly1264qz.jpg

Note the 1/2" S/S spring wrap here too, -as per OE.
These ZigZags on the fuel and brake lines are very important and are rarely seen in line "upgrades". They are purely there in case of an accident where the body of the car may become stretched. Without this deliberate slack, the lines can snap and you'll either end up with no brakes, or a mean fire, or both!
http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/944/assembly1279qf.jpg

The 1/2 line into the tank was fun. How do you join an aluminium line to a steel flange? JB Weld!! Note the Moroso fuel filter gauze.
http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/4708/fueltank002.jpg

However, the problem with JB weld is that is does not conduct electricity.. That means soldering an earth wire from the flange to the sender so the gauge works.. Lucky I checked! :)
http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/8666/fueltank003.jpg

Also, because the sender is a repro :rolleyes: it needed modification so the gauge would read accurately. Here the sender's limiter has been filed to allow more travel, otherwise "full" according to the sender would only read a 3/4 on the gauge.. Lucky I checked that too! :D
http://img67.imageshack.us/img67/3495/fuelpickup0188rk.jpg

http://img67.imageshack.us/img67/4626/fuelpickup0149rp.jpg

The tank ready for installation..
http://img70.imageshack.us/img70/7143/fueltank0049qb.jpg

As per the GM Assembly Manual..
http://img382.imageshack.us/img382/7974/fueltank011.jpg

..and in place (upside down on the rotisserie).
http://img70.imageshack.us/img70/2456/fueltank0097ec.jpg

I'm kind-of over anodizing and braided lines and really like the look of hard lines that the SS L78 396/375 has. This is using an OE brass Y-block, compression and "tube & nut" fittings
http://img128.imageshack.us/img128/2229/engineblackout2084ue.jpg

Figured the fuel pump block-off plate was a good enough place to mount the Holley reg. Another tube & nut fitting here too. The easiest and cheapest way to join hard line to AN. ;)
http://img19.imageshack.us/img19/2815/engineblackout175.jpg

..and finally, mounted here on the side of the booster bracket is the newer much more compact style of AutoMeter fuel pressure isolator. A line runs to it very discretely from the Y-block. ;)
http://img179.imageshack.us/img179/8569/fuelpressureisolator002.jpg
The line then passes through the firewall using a factory dimple reserved for Rally Sport (Z22) vacuum lines (to head lamp switch) (See UPC 0 A9). Like I said, I hate drilling holes, and if I absolutely have to, at least in an intended location. ;)

S[_]SPECT

11-05-2009, 10:19 PM

I have to admit.. I have more than a few chuckles when you've posted "in your factory assembly manual" thinking,, yeah, like I've got one of those..

And then to see you openly post that your car is fake...

I didn't get it..

Now having come back a reading this... I have to say Steve.. your attention to detail is nothing short of outstanding..

To make your own parts is one thing... but to make them look factory is a whole other ball game.. which very few "back yarders" have the skill or patience to pull off.. and you have.

This has got to be the most "Factory Spec" faker out there... job well done mate..

blackoutsteve

11-05-2009, 10:46 PM

Gee, thanks Man. Thanks very much. ;)
Yes, you do get it..
Any modification to this car must look factory. That is the whole point. But at the same time, I really do want an original car, yet I want it RHD with go-fast parts. That's quite a bit of compromise actually.

I guess it all goes back to how poorly converted this car was when I bought it near 20 years ago. The attention to detail is not only a heap of fun for me, I feel it eradicates all those horrid things that were done to it beforehand.

Hey, thanks again Birchy. :)

RSZ28

12-05-2009, 09:08 AM

Thanks for the tips on the brake/fuel line spring armour Steve. Have seen it in Rick's cataldogs, but thought you may have found some readily available here. I know a brake shop that keeps it for trucks, but they only seem to have 1/4".

Are your fuel lines aluminium or stainless? In either case, where did you get the raw straight or coiled tube? And is it still ok to double flare?

And on the 1/2" fuel line armour, is it spring SS, or simply wound SS wire?

Thanks Steve, and once again, outstanding work and progress. Your car will be unique on the planet! :)

chevguy

12-05-2009, 01:17 PM

Awsome job mate,didn`t know about the s-bend fuel/oil line either,makes a hell of a lot of sense.I agree with you totally on the braid/anodizing/chroming thing. I will be going for the same cleaned up factory look you have done.I was considering getting a rotisserie and now with your build I am convinced they are worth it.

blackoutsteve

12-05-2009, 09:17 PM

Thanks ChevyGuy!

Thanks for the tips on the brake/fuel line spring armour Steve. Have seen it in Rick's cataldogs, but thought you may have found some readily available here. I know a brake shop that keeps it for trucks, but they only seem to have 1/4".

Are your fuel lines aluminium or stainless? In either case, where did you get the raw straight or coiled tube? And is it still ok to double flare?

And on the 1/2" fuel line armour, is it spring SS, or simply wound SS wire?

Thanks Steve, and once again, outstanding work and progress. Your car will be unique on the planet! :)

Thanks!
The main fuel line is 1/2" aluminium, right up to the Y-block. It was aluminium to the bowls too, but I felt it was too soft for frequent dismantling with jet changes etc, so I replaced it with Zinc steel (3/8").
The aluminium in available on eBay (USA) is various diameters. (search "aluminum fuel line" -not aluminium) It's light and relatively cheap to post. Comes in 25' rolls.
The steel zinced bundy was bought locally through a brake shop, but you may need to shop around. Any good brake shop should be able to get it in for you. GM used 3/16" for the front brakes and 1/4" for the rears. ;)

The 1/2" spring armour (aka Gravel Gaurd) was made by a local spring maker. It is a spring grade of S/S. Cost me $50 for about 1-2 meters which is heaps.

Rarding brake lines.. You must double flare. ;)

blackoutsteve

12-05-2009, 09:56 PM

This is a chapter that was missed.. The new rear quarter and tail panel.
It's such a pity that the only reason that they were replaced is because they were originally repaired so poorly. Otherwise, they would have easily been straightened out and stayed on the car as original sheetmetal.
Not a spec of rust.
http://img488.imageshack.us/img488/9247/queenscliffe20061198nl.jpg

http://img133.imageshack.us/img133/1118/queenscliffe20061200ig.jpg

http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/3936/quarterpanel026.jpg

http://img105.imageshack.us/img105/1729/maryborough0769yw.jpg

The LH quarter was replaced with a GM quarter around 1995 when they were still available. Damn, I can't find those pics, sorry..

Also, before the body went the he panel shop. I had it plastic bead blasted. I was amazed at how the floorpan came up. Like it was made yesterday! :)
http://img274.imageshack.us/img274/3171/rotisserie0434vd.jpg

http://img274.imageshack.us/img274/6263/rotisserie0457ih.jpg

http://img285.imageshack.us/img285/8872/assembly1068qn.jpg

Trunk painted with Aqua/Black spatter paint.
http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/5583/blackout008.jpg

RSZ28

13-05-2009, 06:53 AM

Thanks!
The main fuel line is 1/2" aluminium, right up to the Y-block. It was aluminium to the bowls too, but I felt it was too soft for frequent dismantling with jet changes etc, so I replaced it with Zinc steel (3/8").
The aluminium in available on eBay (USA) is various diameters. (search "aluminum fuel line" -not aluminium) It's light and relatively cheap to post. Comes in 25' rolls.
The steel zinced bundy was bought locally through a brake shop, but you may need to shop around. Any good brake shop should be able to get it in for you. GM used 3/16" for the front brakes and 1/4" for the rears. ;)

The 1/2" spring armour (aka Gravel Gaurd) was made by a local spring maker. It is a spring grade of S/S. Cost me $50 for about 1-2 meters which is heaps.

Rarding brake lines.. You must double flare. ;)

Thanks again for the info Steve.

Thought you were doing stainless brake lines hence the question on the double flare. In my experience SS is quite difficult to double flare, whereas bundy is much easier.

Interesting that your original brake line has the zig zag. My original 68 lines did not have this. Maybe they had been replaced at some time, or maybe they didnt do this on 68's.

Your pics have inspired me to change my fuel lines to SS. Cant imagine they will do well for long with E85 even though they are new.

Floor came up great! Plenty of hot dip galvanising used on some parts. When you consider the rear rails and rocker panels were hot dip gal'd, the examples that we see rusted out must have been sitting around in some wet and salty climates for a loooong time.

Cheers.

blackoutsteve

13-05-2009, 08:05 PM

Nev68

13-05-2009, 08:23 PM

It appears that the zig zags were not on fuel or brake lines on 68s or 67s. Not to say that there aren't areas that have slack in them..

All my brake lines are steel bundy. I didn't want stainless, -no need to, I didn't want the expense or the difficulty flaring it and the zinced steel will last a long time.

Your right Steve, the 68 doesn't have the zig zags like the 69.
I bent my own steel fuel line up using to original as a template and as you say there is plenty of slack from what appear to be "unnecessary" bends.

Nev

blackoutsteve

15-05-2009, 07:01 PM

Another part of the steering conversion was the center link, or Aussie term "drag link".
Once again, a jig had to be made to ensure that the link was converted accurately. The subframe is converted with exact mirrored dimensions either side of the centerline, so obviously the center link needs to be as well, or what's the point??

A rather heavy 4"x4"x3/8" angle was chosen as a large platform and for it's rigidity (and because I had it laying about!), and a pair of old tie rods were sacrificed for their tapered shafts and welded onto pedestals at the correct heights.

Locating dowels were used to locate the pedestals into the correct positions where they were fastened down, and then more dowels and threads into the opposite locations from the centerline for the conversion.. Following? :p

http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/4982/draglinkjig.jpg

Then the center link was fitted into position.
http://img168.imageshack.us/img168/8471/draglinkinjigph3.jpg

That's all I did.
It was then off to see MrBlue (chassis guru Bluey Wilson) who then did the cutting and welding, had the link stress relieved, heat treated and x-rayed with certificate for me. You don't take chances with these things.. If they fail, people die, which is why they are huge 1 1/8" diameter steel in the first place.

So, back from Bluey, still with the crack-testing paint and fitting beautifully in the jig, all reversed. :)
http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/6430/rhdlinkonjig.jpg

A coat of VHT's "cast iron" paint so it looks and stays pretty..
http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/8061/rhdlink.jpg

..and hey, guess what?? It fits! :D
http://img363.imageshack.us/img363/9927/assembly0160mi.jpg

blackoutsteve

15-05-2009, 07:17 PM

By the way..
With that last photo, you may note that the center link is actually not perfectly perpendicular to the subframe's centerline.. It's slightly aft at the idler's end.
When test fitting and taking measurement before the conversion (while still LHD) I was positive I had a mismatch of parts..
All relative parts, their numbers and dimensions were checked, along with asking questions to the likes of David Pozzi, and it turns out that it's actually completely normal.

Reason:
The Pitman Arm and idler arm are different lengths, which also vary from non-power steering Pitmans and idlers too.
It's not from a lousy steering conversion, which, like I said, is normal when LHD.
Not sure what it does to the steering geometry, but again.. Completely normal.

WILD68

15-05-2009, 07:38 PM

That looks pretty sweet steve, when my old boy had my 68 he had a new drag link made by a black smith and it looked sweet, wasnt as big as yours though by the looks.. i think i have read where you have referred to two different size drag links?

Cheers

Jamie

RSZ28

15-05-2009, 09:08 PM

blackoutsteve

15-05-2009, 09:11 PM

Roller cam install. :D
If you think it's just a cam & lifters.. Forget it!

I knew what was involved with switching to a roller, but when I say the switch set me back nearly $4000, I get really stupid looks. I don't think people realize what's really involved and how much money really good parts cost.
Anyway, this could be a long post.. ;)

A Crane solid roller. About 0.260 @ 0.050" and 0.714" lift on a 114 centerline.
http://img49.imageshack.us/img49/5163/engineblackout0167mz.jpg

Aggressive ramps! :D
http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/560/engineblackout1vt.jpg

Isky lightweight Redzones. Not an off the shelf part at the time. These were special order through Isky. ;)
http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/1348/engineblackout0317hu.jpg

Along with Isky titanium retainers, Isky super-7 degree locks, Isky Gold series Toolroom springs, Isky spring seats (a must with alum heads), Crane teflon seals and a Grolsch!
http://img466.imageshack.us/img466/8503/assembly0538ds.jpg

A used Crane stud girdle which required all new posi-locks.
http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/9079/engineblackout0587md.jpg

The Isky Gold Series Toolroom springs are top shelf stuff. About AU$1100 a set. Good valve springs are extremely important and I wasn't skimping. The head's spring seats needed machining to accomodate their larger diameter. Seat and open pressures are about 260lbs and 650lbs respectively, hence the need for a girdle and Comp Cam's HiTech stainless steel rockers -which I've been using for years.
http://img372.imageshack.us/img372/4859/engineblackout0876ly.jpg

To fit the girdles under the GMPP valve covers, I had to have them milled and notched. I have a good friend who does this for cheap, yet I always insist on paying him more. (Note my coffee table hanging on the engine stand in the background!)
http://img493.imageshack.us/img493/3161/engineblackout0670zl.jpg

http://img493.imageshack.us/img493/5282/engineblackout0618ku.jpg

This is why shaft rockers are the way to go. 700" lift is really beyond the design limits of these engines which were made for cams with not much more than ~550" lift.
Here, you can see that with 0.100" taller than stock valve stems and +0.050" locks, the rocker arm interferes with the retainer. The only way out of this problem without swapping valves is lash caps -which I like to use to protect the stem tips anyway.
The lash caps are 0.050" additional stem height that I obviously need.
http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/1981/withoutlashcap9me.jpg

Choosing the correct pushrod length was pretty easy, but always a compromise. These Trend pushrods are a 3/8" diameter, 0.080" wall one-piece chromemoly...
http://img478.imageshack.us/img478/9025/engineblackout0839fy.jpg

..with ball ends radiused 210 degrees for the rocker arm sockets.
http://img478.imageshack.us/img478/6205/engineblackout0820ae.jpg

Here I used checking springs and a dial indicator to measure piston to valve clearances.
0.120" on the Intakes and 0.177" on the exhaust is heaps! :cool: (See how much additional clearance the lash caps have provided?)
http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/2233/engineblackout0349fe.jpg

Some match porting..

http://img296.imageshack.us/img296/2496/engineblackout1165ja.jpg

http://img296.imageshack.us/img296/3579/engineblackout1213pl.jpg

..and why you don't use FelPro's oval port intake manifold gaskets with Edelbrock's "rectoval" heads..
http://img460.imageshack.us/img460/5381/engineblackout1519pw.jpg

Instead, use the correct GM Signature Series gaskets.
http://img460.imageshack.us/img460/2751/engineblackout1520vh.jpg

It all went together nicely and sounds like this!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wj4kFYCC-5A

blackoutsteve

15-05-2009, 09:17 PM

Does your setup have the fast ratio Pitman arm Steve? Or maybe this was standard on 69's. I recall the centre link on my 68 is parallel to the x member, whereas a fast ratio arm would have it looking like yours.

For 69s with power steering, there is only one Pitman and one idler from memory.
Apart from ratios in the steering box, the only other components that change the ratio are the steering arms that bolt to the spindles, that the tie rods connect to, -which have no effect on the link's angle. (Yes, they are both matching arms on each side.)

..I think I have read where you have referred to two different size drag links?

Yes. I'm pretty sure all power steer cars got the heavy links like mine. Not sure of the smaller diameter, but about 7/8" I think..

Nev68

16-05-2009, 12:15 PM

Steve,
Thanks for sharing your experience.
I'll probably never build a big block but I still like to see this typ eof information.
Liked the video of the motor. Nice idle, nice crisp increase in the revs.

Nev

blackoutsteve

18-05-2009, 09:11 PM

Because I built this 454 with a 12:1 comp for a decent camshaft choice, I've always been mixing in around 33% AvGas with Premium.
It wasn't so much the expense that bothered me, just the inconvenience of going out of my way to buy AvGas, carting it around in a drum in the trunk, mixing it at the fuel stop, and more recently, the fear of getting EPA-ed and fined a million dollars because I'm emitting a minuscule amount of lead out the exhaust.
ROSS custom made to suit Edelbrock 6045 heads and dome enough for 12:1. This piston is my #9 spare.
http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/761/piston001xc8.jpg

Comp test average ~225psi. That pretty reasonable!
http://img91.imageshack.us/img91/9223/compressiontest037.jpg

Anyway, I'm not using AvGas anymore, so I've decided to water inject. ;)

Water injection on it's own (as opposed to 50/50 water/methanol) is good for around 12.5:1 with Premium, so I should be good to go.
The kit I have is a Snow Performance kit that uses a vacuum sensor to detirmine the amount load the engine is seeing and therefore the amount of water to add. Unlike the early Snow kits that were simply on or off, this is now variable injection.
A 1" spacer for the spray nozzle is required to fit betwen the carb and manifold, but I don't have that kind of room. In fact, like all us guys with cowl induction, I have no room at all.
http://img210.imageshack.us/img210/7756/waterinjection003ia6.jpg

Not only do I feel that the spray from the suggested location be less than uniform to all 8 cylinders I figured I'd do a better job at hiding the install as well.
Some improvising with a barb and NPT thread tap..
http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/154/waterinjection009cq0.jpg

A wire bent at the angle of spray to accurately set the nozzle height.
http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/583/waterinjection011.jpg

And installed.:) Here's the beauty of a Victor Jnr. ..all the plumbing is hidden underneath and no unsightly hoses can be seen. Who's to know?
http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/812/waterinjection013fu9.jpg

Pumps out some water!
http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/2850/waterinjection014it3.jpg

Video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tdJ-4zZak1w

Dicko

18-05-2009, 10:17 PM

I'm liking the engine info, will use for a reference later, thanks Steve.

Do you have access to E85 ? That sounds like a good option with the compression you're running.

blackoutsteve

18-05-2009, 10:59 PM

*rayman*

19-05-2009, 10:03 AM

67cammy

19-05-2009, 10:28 AM

Hey Steve how do you go with the PCV in that location. Is it baffled in any way?

blackoutsteve

19-05-2009, 11:14 AM

Is water injection actually frowned upon on the street?

Dumb traffic cops will probably try to tell you its a NOS system if they see any direct port plumbing....

How big of a reservoir do you have for the water, and where did you locate it?

I doubt there is anything illegal about squirting water down the carb of an engine. Diesels have been doing it for decades.
In fact, because water injection acts just like an intercooler, it will be reducing harmful oxides of Ntrogen (NOX) that are given off when engines detonate, so I'm doing a lot more good to the environment than harm. Even adding methanol is no different to using E10.
Also, if a Cop can find a NO2 bottle, sure, he can charge me, but I doubt he's going to find one, let alone see any clue that will have him looking in the first place.
For the container, I used the OE washer bottle as the reservior, and also installed another in the Rally Sport position for the windscreen. So I have two, both in the OE locations.
http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/6343/blackout002tr6.jpg

Hey Steve how do you go with the PCV in that location. Is it baffled in any way?

Not baffled, no. As far as needing a baffle, I'm just going to have to "suck it and see". -pardon the pun.:p
If it does, I'll easily fit a small piece of sheetmetal as a deflector.

chevguy

19-05-2009, 11:53 AM

Dicko

19-05-2009, 12:06 PM

Not sure if E85 would support 12:1 and 40 degrees advance.
The octane I was getting through mixing the Av & Premium was about 98-100 octane. That's the (R+M)/2 method. Premium on it's own is only about 92 via the same method.

There's quite a few articles getting around on big blocks & E85, particularly in the US where it's been used for a fair while. 13:1 seems the ballpark.

Shafiroff even have an E85 option on there street & race motors. Their race motors are 14:1 & the E85 is 13:1

Having spent a lot of time setting up my speedway bikes in the past for methanol, I like a good squeeze of compression :) If E85 was more widely available, I'd love to set mine up for it.

One of these would tickle my fancy

http://www.shafiroff.com/sportsman/540_825_e85.asp

blackoutsteve

19-05-2009, 03:27 PM

when you said you have been using premium Steve I take it you meant the 98 octane stuff? I was running the shell ultimate for race days with my turbo`d 6(25 psi,9.5-1 static comp) with no pinging on that stuff.Lot less timimg then you are running admittedly.

I did mean 98, as in Optimax, Ultimate, Synergy 8000, but don't forget that those 98 ratings are "Research" only numbers. Their averaged octane (Research + Motor) / 2 is only around 92 when comparing against US pump or off the shelf drum ratings.
When I ran straight premium, it would rattle like crazy at very minimal throttle positions.
If you could run 25psi on a 9.5:1 engine on this stuff and get away with it, that amazes me to the point where I'd have to say "Dude, I don't believe it!" :)
25psi with 9.5:1 comp is a mountain of cylinder pressure. Are you sure it wasn't running on diesel?? :p

There's quite a few articles getting around on big blocks & E85, particularly in the US where it's been used for a fair while. 13:1 seems the ballpark.

Shafiroff even have an E85 option on there street & race motors. Their race motors are 14:1 & the E85 is 13:1

Having spent a lot of time setting up my speedway bikes in the past for methanol, I like a good squeeze of compression :) If E85 was more widely available, I'd love to set mine up for it.

One of these would tickle my fancy

http://www.shafiroff.com/sportsman/540_825_e85.asp

Just to clarify..
E85 in the US is 85% Ethanol, not 85% gasoline which is why they can get away with such high comp ratios.
I thought E85 was only 15% Ethanol like our E10, with is 10%.
But yeah, I know of guys running some real good numbers on the stuff.

RSZ28

19-05-2009, 03:30 PM

There's quite a few articles getting around on big blocks & E85, particularly in the US where it's been used for a fair while. 13:1 seems the ballpark.

Shafiroff even have an E85 option on there street & race motors. Their race motors are 14:1 & the E85 is 13:1

Having spent a lot of time setting up my speedway bikes in the past for methanol, I like a good squeeze of compression :) If E85 was more widely available, I'd love to set mine up for it.

One of these would tickle my fancy

http://www.shafiroff.com/sportsman/540_825_e85.asp

E85 is 105 octane, and right at the minute I cant remember whether that is RON or a MON based number, but it is a US quoted number. I use it at 11.8:1, but no 40 degrees total, and different chamber design with flat top slugs and a stock type cam, so dynamic comp is higher than with a "good" cam. It is noticably more resistant to knock than 98....:)

blackoutsteve

19-05-2009, 03:41 PM

I'd guess it as being the average of both RON & MON if it's a US quoted number.

Dicko

19-05-2009, 03:49 PM

chevguy

19-05-2009, 05:02 PM

If you could run 25psi on a 9.5:1 engine on this stuff and get away with it, that amazes me to the point where I'd have to say "Dude, I don't believe it!"
25psi with 9.5:1 comp is a mountain of cylinder pressure. Are you sure it wasn't running on diesel??

That psi figure was taken off the boost control and laptop,Like I said the timing was down to 11 deg from memory at boost and was running 10.5 fuel mixture so it was fat as,but being forced you dont need much timing to make the top end power.Never heard it detonate at all and run 415 rwhp on the dyno.Oh and I was running octane boost on those 25psi days.
That water injection you are setting up is definately the way to go for decent compression.

blackoutsteve

19-05-2009, 06:14 PM

11 degrees total timing? OK, that may explain it, but I'm still surprised.. well actually, I'm impressed! ;)

blackoutsteve

19-05-2009, 06:22 PM

E85 is 85% ethanol & 15% 98 (95?) octane.

It's a real quandry at the moment. Some of the smaller fuel companies are dealing in it, but the mainstream shell. bp etc aren't touching it.

I guess cause it only uses 15% of "thier" product.

E85 is what the V8 supercars went to as a control fuel this year.

It may have something to do with new car warranties as well.
When E10 first came out here, I remember Holden said anything more than 10% ethanol would void their warranty. Not sure what any of the car makers are saying today though.

chevguy

19-05-2009, 08:12 PM

11 degrees total timing? OK, that may explain it, but I'm still surprised.. well actually, I'm impressed! ;)

yup 15 deg static timing but 11 deg with the computer doing it`s thing....all relatively bloody confusing and temperamental hence the massively cubed single carb tune it with a screwdriver approach I am going to now:)

RSZ28

20-05-2009, 09:10 AM

11 degrees total timing? OK, that may explain it, but I'm still surprised.. well actually, I'm impressed! ;)

There are quite a few late model Commodores running around with twin turbo setups, running around 10psi on 10.3:1 or so, producing 400-440rwkw and using 10-12 degrees total timing.

Having started with turbos way back when all we had was carbs and dizzies and no intercoolers, EFI makes this all very straightforward these days (well...by comparison...:) .

At 11.8:1 on E85 I run around 13 total at 3,000rpm, 17 total at 5,200rpm. No a lot of timing, but the torque/power is nothing to complain about.

But there is still a lot to be said for a carb and a dizzy for simplicity. :D

Holden may or may not introduce E85 ready Commodores here in the next 12 months. It will depend on fuel pricing trends.

They already export Commodores to Brazil where all cars must run on E40 or better. GM do an E85 Saab in Oz

Yesterday in Sydney, with 98 at 1.26/l, E85 at 99.7/, so there is no money saving with E85, more the other way around. Of course when the price heads back up to 1.40 for 98 tonight, there is a slight benefit, but nothing to speak of.

E85 is expensive to distribute as it needs a seperate tank at the station, seperate compartments in tankers, seperate handling facilties at the refinery, seperate mixing facilities...the list goes on. Expensive for the big guys, who will only do it once they are pushed by the govt.

Cheers :)

RSZ28

20-05-2009, 09:18 AM

Hey Steve,

Your RHD conversion has made it in to Popular Hot Rodding mate!

http://blogs.popularhotrodding.com/6544448/project-cars/australian-69-camaro-build/index.html

Cheers!

blackoutsteve

20-05-2009, 08:00 PM

Cool, thanks.. But why on Earth did they use this horrible photo?? :p

http://image.popularhotrodding.com/f/project-cars/australian-69-camaro-build/16303988+w225+cr1+re0+ar1/steves-right-hand-drive-69-camaro-project.jpg

Look at that ugly hunk-o-crap!

blackoutsteve

21-05-2009, 11:49 PM

This next bit is adapting a Sanden 508 to the OE Fridgidaire brackets and some mods I had to do to get the Vintage Air unit fitting under the left side of the dash.

Yes, I know I'm a pussy for installing A/C into a muscle car, but it's a car that will be driven on hot, sunny days and I'm not going to cook! :p

1969 A/C brackets are unique. 1968 and earlier are different because of the short water pump, a long water pump was introduced in 1969 and the brackets were then redesigned in 1970.
I found this on eBay for US$50. I guess it was cheap because it was part of an incomplete set, and the missing bracket that mounts the Fridgidaire is useless to me anyway.
http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/9209/mainacbracket.jpg

Once again, cardboard templates based on the design of the original bracket and a junk 508 to test fit..
http://img195.imageshack.us/img195/9952/sample508inplace.jpg

http://img201.imageshack.us/img201/5789/actemplateforsanden5087jl.jpg

Accurate drawings for the laser cutters, and the bracket is pretty-much done..
http://img201.imageshack.us/img201/2162/acbrktsandplans6tv.jpg

Painted and installed with a new factory black Sanden 508.
As you can see, the valve cover is still removable, which would not be possible if it were a Fridgidaire. .;)
http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/8320/engineblackout199.jpg

http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/8835/engineblackout1808ca.jpg

The Vintage Air unit seems a pretty good unit and I bought this prior to the release of the newer GenIV model which would be better but, oh well. I can live with the cable control..

The evaporator fitted reasonable well with only modifications to the positions to the vent outlets. This is the original layout, although it's quite hard to see.
There are 5 vents basically. The top 2 in this pic are the demister vents, They stay as they are. (Ignore what I'm pointing at.)
http://img268.imageshack.us/img268/5112/porttolhdashvent.jpg

The unit, when intalled in the LH dash cavity, stays upright and is simply rotated around. This faces the some of the 3 dash vents directly into the firewall, so they needed modification. Here you can see how I arranged them so they are directed upward, away from the firewall. Vintage Air were good enough to send me new vent "blanks" for me to weld in place.
http://img369.imageshack.us/img369/8050/modifiedoutlets2nk.jpg

This hole in the firewall with the fan housing poking through is what I originally thought the trade-off was going to be. I knew the heater cover would hide it but still figured how I was able to gain an additional feature..
http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/7834/accelerator006.jpg

The Vintage Air A/C units don't have fresh air. They only recirculate the air within the car. Because the fan is partially pretruding out into the heater cover, I decided to make a closable flap in the "original" (:p) air inlet. This leads to a previously defunct cable control on the driver's kick panel. If I want fresh air, I pull the cable and fresh air enters the car. Cool huh? :cool:

Oh, and the good thing is, I end up with more glovebox than the LHD installation! :D

A small problem was the floor vent. It now faced the wrong direction and would become useless.
http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/4007/evapunderdash1.jpg

So, using original vents from an A/C floor distribution duct, I made some cones and welded into the floor vent component of the evaporator.. I reckon they look a bit ugly, but their fuction should be just fine and mostly hidden by the console anyway.
http://img367.imageshack.us/img367/9180/evapinplacewfloorducts6vi.jpg

http://img265.imageshack.us/img265/7020/discretefloorducts.jpg

Here's the cramped inside of the heater cover. It contains the A/C and water hoses to the engine bay. The heater hoses needed to exit at the (big block) OE position while the A/C to exit somewhat hidden under the fender.
Just before installation. :)
http://img265.imageshack.us/img265/3060/accelerator005.jpg

Nicely restored A/C baffles. Bought the rubber mat from Clark Rubber and used the old aprons as a template. These were fitted to all A/C cars to prevent air dodging the radiator/condensor and moving around the sides of the radiator support.
http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/2474/engineblackout203.jpg

Nev68

22-05-2009, 07:31 PM

[http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/2474/engineblackout203.jpg[/QUOTE]

Steve,
Nothing wrong with being comfortable in your muscle car.
Do you get the refrigerant lines with the Vintage Air kit?

Where does the evaporator condensate drain to?

Where do those baffles fit? Can I see it in my Factory assembly manual?

It looks like you can access the AC evap fan mtr from inside the car. Is that right?
I found out that it is virtually impossible to replace the original fan mtr on my 68 without removing the front guard ( or at least that's the only way I could see to replace the fan)

Nev

blackoutsteve

22-05-2009, 08:04 PM

The refrigerant lines I made up. I have a mate who does auto air conditioning and he has the fittings and crimper.;)

The drainage for the evap will ("will" as in, I haven't done it yet).. simply drain somewhere where the floor, firewall and trans meet. I don't want to have it drip on a hot exhaust. Not because I'm worried about the stainless, but because I hate that pssst psst psst as it drips on a hot exhaust after parking the car. My Statesman does that. :rolleyes:

In your Assembly Manual, UPC C60-B3, it shows them on either side of the support. 68s are a little different in shape to 69s.
Here's the page...
http://img38.imageshack.us/img38/6690/airconditioning007.th.jpg (http://img38.imageshack.us/my.php?image=airconditioning007.jpg)

..and here's my baffles. I just took this pic and damn, look at the dust. ..and the mess! :o
http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/8553/airconditioning002.jpg

I'm not using a fan on the heater box. In fact, that motor is hollow, as all the armature has been removed. But yes, removing the fender is what you'll have to do to access it. Accessing the fan on the Vintage Air would be difficult. I'll hope I never have to.

To add to the above posts, here's a pic that shows the condenser. It also shows the water injection water pump and control unit.
http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/4861/airconditioning004sml.jpg

blackoutsteve

22-05-2009, 08:27 PM

The radiator is a 5 core copper/brass using correct repro tanks. Norm at Aussie Desert Cooler put it together for me and it has a heap of capacity.
454 with 12:1 c/r, a 180F thermostat and trusty 7 blade clutch fan, this engine would sit on 185-190F all the time. 35C days in traffic, maybe it would see 200F.

This is it with the heavy duty curved neck that many (but not all) COPO Camaros had, as well as many (all?) L34/35 big blocks with air/con. It's function is to move the hose away from the a/c compressor.
http://img35.imageshack.us/img35/6863/radiator002.jpg

I didn't realize it at the time, but I had to take it back to Norm so he could "clock" the inlet tube for me.. It has an incline of about 30 degrees that I didn't notice in my resto books..
http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/7556/curvedneck001xo8.jpg

blackoutsteve

25-05-2009, 07:57 PM

The oil pump.. This is a long story, so go grab a beer or stick the kettle on, get yourself comfy and have a read! :D
This is my more controversal modification. Controversal to me really, although I'm sure others reading this will think I am nuts. :)
With GMs super reliable stock oiling system, I never thought I would need to do what I ended up doing. I performed several tests to try and prove to myself that the modification wasn't required, but in the end, it was, and I did.

This is a carry-over "problem" from the roller cam installation that I had no idea about until I ran the engine for general checks and setting lash prior to having it dynoed.
http://img110.imageshack.us/img110/4138/fireup013re9.jpg

Prior to the rollercam install, oil pressure was always very good. Hot; 20psi at idle and 60-65psi at ~2000 rpm up with Mobil 1 15W50.
After the roller install, pressure dropped to below 10psi at idle and no more than 45 hot. WTF? :eek:

After finding a bad thrust bearing, the main bearings had been swapped over to a new set. Probably sustained from when I broke a TCI input shaft shortly before. Going from Clevite 77s to Federal Mogul in the same -0.002" undersize proved not a good idea, and I originally thought that was my reason for my low oil pressure.. That's 0.002", not 0.020". Clevite don't make 0.002" anymore which is a pity. Like 0.001", they can be a handy size.
http://img190.imageshack.us/img190/5025/garagestuff030sml.jpg

800hp my arse!
http://img461.imageshack.us/img461/154/assembly0791az.jpg

This is a Plastigage check showing around 0.004" clearance with repalcement bearings of the same size.:eek: Yes, it surprised me a lot to say the least. I'm sure they're correct 0.002", but I'm guessing crush is a lot different between brands.
http://img102.imageshack.us/img102/3253/mainbearings0272us5.jpg

The original main bearings were swapped back in -with exception to the #5 which luckily was good. Clearance was restored to the 0.0025-0.0028" range when originally assembled..
http://img264.imageshack.us/img264/1600/mainbearings040px8.jpg

http://img264.imageshack.us/img264/589/mainbearings042xf0.jpg

http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/6135/mainbearings0315.jpg

Original mains and rods still in perfect condition.. (Man, these has seen some revs. ;) )
http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/2294/mainno3.jpg

http://img260.imageshack.us/img260/7599/garagestuff004pv1.jpg

However.. Oil pressure did not return to pre-rollercam pressures. :(
Trying to isolate where the oil pressure may have been lost, tapping the gauge into each end on the main gallery revealed the same results. That's good, but I still didn't find out where the problem is.
http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/6006/fireup2013ie7.jpg

This is where I tap my oil pressure gauge into normally. Always furthest from the pump because you really want to know lowest pressure in the mains, and not the highest.
http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/1821/fireup2012rr2.jpg

So after checking everything, the only thing I could think of was the only other change -the roller lifters. All roller lifters, especially good ones like the Isky Redzones that I have, have pressurized oiling to the roller axles and a shot of oil onto the roller as well.

16 lifters that each have 3 x 0.024" bleed holes in them. I contacted isky and they confirmed about a 12psi pressure loss across the board when using a roller cam. Bingo! :rolleyes:

Solution: Feed it more oil. ie; a bigger pump.
Problem: I already have a high volume pump fitted.

This is not a bypass valve issue. Bear in mind that the bypass valve in the pump only controls the maximum oil pressure achieved and has zero effect on any pressures below the bypass setting. Stock setting is 60-65psi. I shim the bypass spring 1/8" to maintain max pressure with the external filter and oil to water heat exchanger. This is a Detroit Diesel unit. Does an awesome job.
http://img475.imageshack.us/img475/5797/assembly0773qu.jpg

There is a lot of misunderstanding about standard and high volume pump pressures. During operation below the maximum oil pressure (before the bypass valve opens), a high volume pump does in fact make more pressure than a standard volume pump.

So, because I am now bleeding more oil through my new roller lifters than before, I now need to increase the oil volume with an even larger oil pump.

Basically, what I did was increase the oil pump exactly the same way that GM did. The standard GM pump has 1.14" tall gears, GM's HV 1.3" and Melling's HV77 1.39", which is what I was using.
Sacrificing another Melling pump I increased the gear height to 1.765", or a 27% increase over the HV77.
I had my machinist friend Mike do the work for me. Unfortunately I don't have the machinery to do this kind of work.
http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/3802/oilpumpmod013pl8.jpg

http://img242.imageshack.us/img242/1544/oilpumpmod016ag8.jpg

http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/4948/oilpumpmod012sb1.jpg

http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/5589/oilpumpmod020ra8.jpg

Running the engine with a radiator to get the temps up..
http://img468.imageshack.us/img468/5500/oilpumpmod029lu5.jpg

..and pressure is restored.. Yay! :D
http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/6528/oilpumpmod025re4.jpg

Another mod is to send bypassing oil to the pan instead of back to the inlet side of the pump. This reduces cavitation greatly. All aftermarket pumps do this.
http://img127.imageshack.us/img127/8939/oilpumpmod039fs6.jpg

http://img127.imageshack.us/img127/3775/oilpumpmod041ik2.jpg

AUSCAMARO

25-05-2009, 10:35 PM

Crikey Steve, you certainly are thorough...

Mitch

RSZ28

26-05-2009, 08:44 AM

Now there's a great way to skin the oil pressure cat! :D

67cammy

26-05-2009, 09:24 AM

Is there anything you haven't documented? Quite amazing :)

TUFF68

26-05-2009, 02:32 PM

As usual Steve, a very interesting and informative read. I actually learnt something about oil pressure and roller cams ;)

WILD68

26-05-2009, 03:10 PM

Steve that oil pump setup is amazing, did you get the idea from somewhere? is it proven ie have you driven it with that pump in, what im asking is do you think it will last as long as a standard non modified pump?

blackoutsteve

26-05-2009, 08:39 PM

The pump will last. There is no problem about it's reliabilty.. Interference fitted dowel pins holding on the additional gear won't budge.
However, with 27% more volume (read; 27% more load), it's definitely advisable that I use a quality ARP oil pump drive, and continue to use synthetic oil for low resistance when cold.
As for operating oil pressures, when on the dyno, the oil pressure was just fine. Normal! :)

The idea? GM gave me the idea. Have you compared a standard volume to a high volume pump before? They are identical with exception the the gear and body heights. That's how they make them bigger. I just did exactly the same thing using a doner pump for the addtional 3/8" in height.

Unlike a supercharger, if you want more volume (volume = pressure), you speed it up in relation to crank speed. With an oil pump, you can't speed it up, so you make the pump bigger. Same result as if you swapped to a bigger blower. ;)

The other option was to buy a Titan oil pump. But at US$500 for a Sportsman or US$940 for a Pro unit (plus US$114 for additional volume), my way was cheaper.
http://www.titanspeed.com/content/pump/

RSZ28

27-05-2009, 11:33 AM

Nev68

27-05-2009, 04:05 PM

Some great engineering there sure saved you a bucket Steve. :)

FYI - interestingly GM on current model small blocks (GenIV/V) is now going for variable volume pumps so they dont waste power on pumping oil un-necessarily and can cater for broader oil flow needs.

Cheers!

How do they control the volume?

Nev

blackoutsteve

27-05-2009, 07:50 PM

Here is one way..
Variable displacement pumps.
http://science.howstuffworks.com/backhoe-loader8.htm

Nev68

27-05-2009, 09:26 PM

Here is one way..
Variable displacement pumps.
http://science.howstuffworks.com/backhoe-loader8.htm

Intersting, I suppose that the variable pump would be hooked up to a sensor for RPM changes or something in the late model cars that have sophisticated electronics.

Nev

RSZ28

28-05-2009, 09:46 AM

Acutally in the case of the new GM oil pump with variable volume/displacement, it is 100% mechanical.

It is a vane pump with sliding vanes in the rotor, and uses a moving stator which is controlled by a spring. Oil pressure moves the stator back and forth against the spring and the intake and outlet side displacement/volume changes.

Will post a pic as soon as I find it. :)

blackoutsteve

30-05-2009, 08:00 PM

Rear axle.
Now. The ONLY reason a bloody Ford 9" is in this car :p is because it was already there when I bought it all those years ago.
However, it was the only thing done to the car correctly. Centered, straight, square, correct width and with the correct pinion angle.
I fully intend on fitting a 12 bolt (most probably a Moser), which will probably be when I confirm what rear gear ratio I want. It currently has 4.11s, and I think I'll end up wanting/needing 4.3s as my rpm in the traps was too low. But we'll see how the 60fts improve (improve ?) with the new 9.5" 5500 converter first.
http://img25.imageshack.us/img25/3521/stallconverter001noname.jpg

This is a Ford Motorsport carrier with the Daytona Pinon support. Twin-rib and the N stands for Nodular! (Der!:rolleyes:) Inside is a set of Strange 4.11s and a FoMoCo Detroit Locker.
(Twin-rib "WAB" & "WAR" carriers (without the N) are the weakest carriers of all. One exception is the C4AW-B carrier that may or may not have an N. http://www.kevinstang.com/Ninecase.htm. I like to point this out because some years ago, a local trans/diff store attempted to sell me a twin-rib carrier for an inflated nodular price. :mad:)
http://img295.imageshack.us/img295/782/pumkinfitted3ub.jpg

31 spline Mosers and regular Ford drums.
http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/4338/moseranddrumassy.jpg

Brake lines with 69 Camaro 12 bolt hoses & brackets..
http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/2401/9inchbrakeline.jpg

When stripping the old paint, I found this huge crack. So, I finally found out why the axle continued to leak oil after replacing several seals, gaskets and having the yoke linished. :rolleyes: I cut a V-groove and welded the repair.
If I hadn't seen this, I'm sure the crack would have made it all the way around and hate to think of the consequences..
http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/3415/crackedhousing.jpg

Ready to install (except for the wheels). Note the much longer length of the traction bars. These push at a point along an imaginary line drawn between the tyre's contact patch and the car's CG. This means the traction bars provide lift to the car's CG for maximum tyre loading/traction.. At least, that's the theory!
http://img295.imageshack.us/img295/6208/9inchcomplete1gf.jpg

In!
http://img231.imageshack.us/img231/8589/assembly1185db.jpg

http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/5853/rolling001.jpg

RSZ28

31-05-2009, 09:48 AM

You still using rubber pads either side of the mono spring at the spring mounts on the axle Steve?

& any idea where the CG would be on yours with the BBC?

Cheers! :)

AUSCAMARO

31-05-2009, 11:26 AM

http://img231.imageshack.us/img231/8589/assembly1185db.jpg

Hey thats cheating...

Damn, I wish I could roll the 68 over to allow access to grind the welds from the front eye bush mount bracket. Gunna be a pain laying on my back to do it.

Nice one Steve.

Mitch

blackoutsteve

31-05-2009, 11:32 AM

No rubber pads between leafs and plates, and very thin rubber snubbers between steel of the lift points only to keep the noise down from when they hit.

Total car weight 3660 lbs (-before resto and without power windows and air con.)
Front axle weight 2220 lbs.
Rear axle weight 1440 lbs.
2220 / 3660 = 0.6066 or 60.66% total weight on the front. That's basically a F/R weight distribution of 60/40. That's not bad actually.
Wheel base is 108" so, 108 x .6 = 64.8" or 64.8" from the rear axle. Also ..or 43.2" from the front axle..

CG height is a tough one, but camshaft height is very typical of these cars.
I intend measuring one day, but it will involve jacking up one end of the car as high as possible while weighing the other, and a lot of math.

blackoutsteve

31-05-2009, 11:35 AM

Hey thats cheating...

Damn, I wish I could roll the 68 over to allow access to grind the welds from the front eye bush mount bracket. Gunna be a pain laying on my back to do it.

Nice one Steve.

Mitch

Can't you take the brackets off? 3 bolts plus the leaf through-bolt?

AUSCAMARO

31-05-2009, 11:51 AM

Can't you take the brackets off? 3 bolts plus the leaf through-bolt?

Have a look at the 3rd last pic in my build up thread Steve, when the frame connectors were installed they have welded them (chook crap weld) to the brackets...

Mitch

RSZ28

01-06-2009, 06:49 PM

blackoutsteve

01-06-2009, 08:00 PM

Static pinion angle will vary depending on how much your leaf springs deflect under load, and how much load your engine is capable of providing, -obviously.
Spring deflection will vary between monos and multis and their different spring rates as well.
And.. It will also depend on ride height (when under load as some cars squat, some lift), as this changes the angle between the tailshaft and pinion.
In theory, Camaros lift at the rear because the front spring eye points rearward of the car's CG.

So it's not the engine C/L, but the driveshaft C/L that must be zero when loaded.

This is where traction bars with adjustable snubbers that lift at either the front spring eye or the body can be adjusted to alter the pinion angle.
Pinion angle with short traction bars that touch the spring between the eye and axle will contunually vary. They stop axle hop and that's about it.

blackoutsteve

14-06-2009, 11:08 PM

The exhaust system will be getting fabbed starting next week. One thing I have been up to in preparation, is modifying the N10 dual exhaust rear hangers so they accomodate the new 3.5" diameter. The muffler hangers are fine. Just 3.5" U-bolts are added to them.

These are repro hangers, so modifying them is of no concern to me. (I once saw NOS N10 muffler hangers sell on eBay for just over US$1000!!:eek:)

Drill out the spot welds to release the OE 2.25" straps.. I measured them and actually think they are closer to 2". Gee, tiny considering ZL1s without the later discontinued NC8 chambered exhausts tried to breathe through them.
http://img91.imageshack.us/img91/5047/exhausthangers001.jpg

Mark out a new (old) piece of 1" strap. (The calculator is for Pi.;))
http://img91.imageshack.us/img91/4196/exhausthangers006.jpg

I used tape to hold on the spacer and cut a section from a short piece of angleline, and positioned them in the vice, then I tightened like hell!
http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/9587/exhausthangers007.jpg

http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/8839/exhausthangers011.jpg

Then wrapped the strap around a 3.5" section of steam pipe I had in my heap. (Yes, I should have drilled those two holes afterwards.)
http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/671/exhausthangers016.jpg

Tap a thread.. (Focus!:o) ..and do it all again for the otherside.
http://img30.imageshack.us/img30/301/exhausthangers017.jpg

http://img30.imageshack.us/img30/1588/exhausthangers018.jpg

Weld them on and add some paint. This is the closest color in high temp VHT they have. It looks like grey primer in these pics, but it's actually the high temp flat silver. A mile off, but better than rust, eh.
http://img30.imageshack.us/img30/629/exhausthangers024.jpg

A tight fit for this system will be a serious understatement.
http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/3312/exhausthangers029.jpg

http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/8783/exhausthangers025.jpg

Using two round Borla XR-1 Sportsman race mufflers fitted transversely, this is the plan..:p
Wish me luck 'cos I don't reckon it's gonna fit!
http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/9324/nc8a2sml.png

(Two oval Borlas XR-1 Sportsmans will also be fitted in the regular location.)

cluxford

15-06-2009, 08:14 AM

Steve, wow the work you do to keep the authenticity of you car is nothing short of outstanding

RSZ28

15-06-2009, 09:25 AM

Nev68

15-06-2009, 02:31 PM

Good stuff Steve.
I've got to hang my exahust to.
68 is slightly different to 69 as the mount hoes are on the underside of the rails (not the side as on the 69)
I'll have to drill out some snapped off bolts as some heavy fisted bugger has snapped off bolts.

Where will your exhuast end? (behind the wheels or out the back under the bumper?)

Nev

blackoutsteve

15-06-2009, 07:14 PM

Where will your exhuast end? (behind the wheels or out the back under the bumper?)

Nev

Thanks Guys..

Nev, I'm ending the system between the rear leafs and 1/4 panel, just before the rear valance panel..
There isn't much room there, my previous 3" system used to rattle a bit and there is no way the 3.5" will fit. Unless.. ;)

Oval tubing!
http://www.burnsstainless.com/OvalTubing/ovaltubing.html

A 3.5" diameter is only 2.375" wide when on it's side.
I have 2 lengths of Burn's oval tubing and a couple of short transistions that go from round to oval, so no volume is lost. :D
That's right, those oval sections are US$142 each!!

http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/5783/exhausthh9.jpg

blackoutsteve

21-06-2009, 10:11 AM

Last night. Taking the Camaro off to get the exhaust system built. Finally!:rolleyes: :D
http://img265.imageshack.us/img265/6895/img4116z.jpg

John and myself discussing the system. (Mainly me explaining the desired details throughout the system, and simply proving how fussy I am. ..and I am! :p)
http://img81.imageshack.us/img81/8398/img4134.jpg

Check out these babies from BurnsStainless.
http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/9679/exhaust001kn3.jpg

This is why I am fussy. These collectors, the oval tubing, the transistions, all the clips, the clamps, the 4 Borlas, the mandrel bends, the laser cut flanges.. This stuff already owes me comfortably over $3K.

Anyway, more progressive pics to come..
Should be a real nice system when John's done. ;)

chevelle

21-06-2009, 11:42 AM

Great job on the exhaust, love this. Its great to see good workmanship.

WILD68

21-06-2009, 03:13 PM

Steve looks like you are using stainless for your headers? What grade are you gonna use?

blackoutsteve

21-06-2009, 05:20 PM

Yep, the entire system is 304. ;)

WILD68

21-06-2009, 05:40 PM

Yep, the entire system is 304. ;)

Nice, i have heard mixed opinions about it cracking and told to use another grade stainless, ( cant remember ) but it is the one that actually rusts cos they reckon it doesnt crack? Dunno but i reckon i will use the 304 when the time comes..

Nev68

21-06-2009, 05:56 PM

Just noticed you have even got original ( or look-alike) rear shocks.

Nev

blackoutsteve

21-06-2009, 06:49 PM

Nice, i have heard mixed opinions about it cracking and told to use another grade stainless, ( cant remember ) but it is the one that actually rusts cos they reckon it doesnt crack? Dunno but i reckon i will use the 304 when the time comes..

304 is the best option for naturally aspirated applications. OE stainless is a 4-series grade which is cheap and not that good.
316, 321 & 347 grades are better, but not required unless extreme heat from turbo charging and/or exposed to salt (marine applications) Those grades can be hellishly expensive and simply not available in many sizes.
Even getting the 304 grade in 2-1/8" mandrel bends was hard enough.
http://www.burnsstainless.com/TechArticles/Stainless_article/stainless_article.html

Just noticed you have even got original ( or look-alike) rear shocks.

Nev

Yep, I have them on the front as well.
The right rear however, is a Monroe airshock. I painted it the same (correct!! :p) putty-grey as the others so it's not really noticeable. I put about 50 psi in it to preload the axle's torque reaction. Made a huge improvement. ;)

RSZ28

22-06-2009, 08:41 AM

That Burns Stainless stuff is outstanding. Nothing quite like it. Would love at set of Burns TriY's, but at US$3000, :eek:

Steve are you doing 2 1/8" primaries for your headers? :cool:

Interesting on your move with the air shock on the RHS rear, what sort of effect did this have to the regular spring wrap up?

Cheers :)

304 is the best option for naturally aspirated applications. OE stainless is a 4-series grade which is cheap and not that good.
316, 321 & 347 grades are better, but not required unless extreme heat from turbo charging and/or exposed to salt (marine applications) Those grades can be hellishly expensive and simply not available in many sizes.
Even getting the 304 grade in 2-1/8" mandrel bends was hard enough.
http://www.burnsstainless.com/TechArticles/Stainless_article/stainless_article.html

Yep, I have them on the front as well.
The right rear however, is a Monroe airshock. I painted it the same (correct!! :p) putty-grey as the others so it's not really noticeable. I put about 50 psi in it to preload the axle's torque reaction. Made a huge improvement. ;)

cluxford

22-06-2009, 09:24 AM

I was/am seriously consider oval tubing also for my pipes to ensure I can get the low stance I want. I am lucky that I have exhaust cutouts in my cross member, so will try 3" circle pipes through there first.

But once again Steve you are raising the bar !

It's almost like watching you walk this "down the line"

blackoutsteve

23-06-2009, 12:11 AM

That Burns Stainless stuff is outstanding. Nothing quite like it. Would love at set of Burns TriY's, but at US$3000, :eek:

Steve are you doing 2 1/8" primaries for your headers? :cool:

Interesting on your move with the air shock on the RHS rear, what sort of effect did this have to the regular spring wrap up?

Cheers :)

The primaries are 2" stepping to 2 1/8".

The air shock does nothing as far as spring wrap-up is concerned.. The oreload is to counter-act against the axle's torque reaction that is trying to lift it off the pavement.

I was/am seriously consider oval tubing also for my pipes to ensure I can get the low stance I want. I am lucky that I have exhaust cutouts in my cross member, so will try 3" circle pipes through there first.

Thanks Bud..
Oval tubing is good, but very expensive. You'll probably find you don't need to build the entire system out of it, only the sections that don't offer much ground clearance.

I still have my old 3" system for sale if you're willing to try. Suits 67-69 1st gens. ;)
http://www.usmuscle.com.au/Forum/showthread.php?t=2331

J.J.

23-06-2009, 01:14 PM

http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/9679/exhaust001kn3.jpg

:eek: :eek:

thats a work of art

blackoutsteve

02-07-2009, 07:01 PM

The first pair of flanges I had made would have been difficult to build on, as they would not have allowed each primary to be cut and tacked together, then removed for final welding individually and refitted for the next primary to be made around it and so on..
So, the Camaro has been sitting and waiting for near 2 weeks for the new flanges to be cut. I finally got them today.

I opened up the port slightly to better fit the 2" primary as well. The original plan was to double step from 1-7/8" to 2" to 2-1/8".
Now, just one step from 2" to 2-1/8". The overall primary lengths are to be 33"-34" with the step halfway at the 18"-19" mark. That's 33"-34" plus 3" of exhaust port length which is why 18"-19" is halfway..;)

http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/4228/flanges008.jpg

OK, now to get these to John and let get this system made!!

blackoutsteve

10-07-2009, 08:01 PM

Things are happening a tad slowly, but here is the collector/megaphone and just a pair of primaries so far.. Just a few tacks and yet to be welded.
The vacuum cleaner style hose is useful for a basic idea of where the primaries are to be routed, as well as getting the primaries all the same length.

Hopefully by next week, the set of headers will be finished. Then it's on to the rest of the system.. :D Bitchn' !

http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/6063/headers009.jpg

http://img398.imageshack.us/img398/6205/headers002.jpg

http://img44.imageshack.us/img44/9674/headers001.jpg

69SS

10-07-2009, 10:49 PM

Steve,

I have just spent that last 1.5hrs reading through your build.. Totally awesome.. Your engineering an fabrication skills are incredible, and I love the small touches like the vacum cleaner hose to balance out the primaries. Cant wait to see the finished system!

Lyndsay

blackoutsteve

11-07-2009, 06:17 AM

Thank you Lyndsay, but don't give me any credit for the exhaust system! I'm only the poor sap paying a million dollars for it!! :p :D

69coupe

11-07-2009, 11:40 AM

Steve,
What size OD are the primaries ?

blackoutsteve

11-07-2009, 02:48 PM

2" stepping to 2-1/8".

chevguy

11-07-2009, 07:21 PM

Man your car is clean and tidy underneath,did you spray it in a sound deadener and paint or just paint steve?

blackoutsteve

11-07-2009, 07:28 PM

Just paint like the factory did.. 30% gloss. ;)

RSZ28

12-07-2009, 05:27 PM

Beautiful work as usual Steve. A real credit to you.

Also your tenacity on this project is exceptional too! Been on the go 3 or 4 years or more? Most would have lost interest in a lesser project. Kudos to you for keeping at it and maintaining the focus on the originality of the RHD conversion! :)

blackoutsteve

12-07-2009, 06:26 PM

Thanks a heap. :)
I started the resto in 2002, so yeah, it's been a while in the making. I bought a house and I work 6 days a week. It doesn't leave much time to work on the car. The money (for once) is not a problem, it's the lack of time.

I know I could work only 5 days a week, and then I could pay the mortgage another $100,000 in interest for another 10 years as well as do without my new garage. Put like that, the choice is surprisingly easy. :D

Nev68

13-07-2009, 02:30 PM

blackoutsteve

13-07-2009, 07:19 PM

Snapped a few more pics today.. Another one & 1/2 primaries are tacked on and as you can see, it's a reasonably tight squeeze. :)

http://img93.imageshack.us/img93/4954/headers015.jpg

http://img93.imageshack.us/img93/2530/headers018.jpg

http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/6897/headers022.jpg

I can't wait to see how the other side fits in with the starter and steering box as obsticles. :o
This pic is looking up through the right side. The mini starter is wrapped under the fibreglass blanket that keeps it heat protected, alond with the fuel line which has Taylor's Fire Sleeve.

http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/512/headers034.jpg

cluxford

13-07-2009, 08:14 PM

Steve, outstanding as usual, those pipes look awesome.

RSZ28

14-07-2009, 07:20 PM

Snapped a few more pics today.. Another one & 1/2 primaries are tacked on and as you can see, it's a reasonably tight squeeze. :)

I can't wait to see how the other side fits in with the starter and steering box as obsticles. :o

This pic is looking up through the right side. The mini starter is wrapped under the fibreglass blanket that keeps it heat protected, alond with the fuel line which has Taylor's Fire Sleeve.

Great work there as usual Steve!

Where does the fibreglass insulation come from?

:)

blackoutsteve

14-07-2009, 08:03 PM

Try Summit or Jegs. ;)
Try Chris at Speed-Pro too.

http://www.summitracing.com/search/Part-Type/Starter-Heat-Shield-Wraps/?keyword=starter

http://http://www.summitracing.com/search/?keyword=taylor%20fire&dds=1

chevguy

14-07-2009, 09:15 PM

Great work there as usual Steve!

Where does the fibreglass insulation come from?

:)

I get that insulation from a turbo repair shop myself.

blackoutsteve

14-07-2009, 09:19 PM

Yep, even Pirtek sell the Fire Sleeve. However their high price and only orange stock encouraged me to shop on the other side of the world.:)

blackoutsteve

15-07-2009, 07:41 PM

With the exception of final welding and a few other finishing touches like O2 & thermocouple bungs and collector springs.. This side is complete. :D

http://img196.imageshack.us/img196/896/headers044.jpg

Damn, look at that dust.. :o
http://img197.imageshack.us/img197/5484/headers046.jpg

http://img197.imageshack.us/img197/3166/headers053.jpg

Another look at the otherside..
http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/5108/headers055.jpg

Nev68

15-07-2009, 08:37 PM

Now this may seem a stupid question but......
I understand what O2 & thermocouple bungs are, but what are collector springs?

Nev

blackoutsteve

15-07-2009, 08:51 PM

Nev68

16-07-2009, 03:23 PM

Primary tubes are a "slip fit" into the collectors. They're not welded.
There are a few different ways of holding them on. Some prefer bolts. I prefer springs.

http://www.burnsstainless.com/images/Spring.jpg http://www.burnsstainless.com/images/WireTab.jpg

http://www.burnsstainless.com/Hardware/Tabs-O2-Rings/tabs-o2-rings.html

You learn something new every day.
How's the seal between the primary pipes and the collector? (sorry if this is another stupid question)
Does use of the springs make installation of the header easier?

Nev

muggz

16-07-2009, 04:27 PM

Dont know if i say it much but i love your RHD conversion :D
Build is coming along well!!!

blackoutsteve

16-07-2009, 08:11 PM

You learn something new every day.
How's the seal between the primary pipes and the collector? (sorry if this is another stupid question)
Does use of the springs make installation of the header easier?

Nev

The slip-fit is supposed to be tight, but some leaking is expected. Very minimal though. The reason they are slip-fit is you simply can't get in and weld around all four primaries.
The springs come off very quickly and easily and maintain tension which is why I prefer them.

Dont know if i say it much but i love your RHD conversion :D
Build is coming along well!!!

Thanks Muggz :D

1968SS

17-07-2009, 07:17 AM

The rightup on the project is amazing as for the car I'm speechless,the amount of time ,money and hours you have spent is a credit to you.
If it was mine I would have wanted it on the road in the first week.

Cheers Mark.

RSZ28

17-07-2009, 09:34 AM

The slip-fit is supposed to be tight, but some leaking is expected. Very minimal though. The reason they are slip-fit is you simply can't get in and weld around all four primaries.

The springs come off very quickly and easily and maintain tension which is why I prefer them.

Also the "male" pipe if its on the engine side is normally hotter than its "female" counterpart so expands more and usually the seal is quite good. Always used these with tight header setsups and even with turbo setups and no appreciable leaks. At least none you can hear going "phut phut phut". :)

blackoutsteve

17-07-2009, 06:32 PM

Wow, thanks a heap Mark..;)

And RSZ28, I never thought about the difference in heat/expansion of the slip fit. Very good. Thanks too! :D

blackoutsteve

18-07-2009, 01:51 PM

Now this is tight! When you increase the primary by 1/8", you actually loose a 1/4" when 2 primaries are right next to each other wanting the same space, and often the center-line-radii (CLR) is more on the larger diameters as well.
Anyway, the power steering lines I made were interfering and they'll need rethinking and redoing, but that's pretty easy.
Only half of #2 and #4 so far.. ..ran out of 2" J-bends.. ..I'll have to order some more on Monday.

http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/3500/headers059.jpg

http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/9845/headers060.jpg

http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/7430/headers066.jpg

blackoutsteve

25-07-2009, 01:45 PM

Still only tacked together, but this is how the driver's side is taking shape.. Only #8 to go, which will be very bendy in order to use up length.

http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/2783/headers067.jpg

Not much clearance between the steering components, but at least there is with steering pointing straight ahead. It turned out that steering to the right would push the inner tie rod end hard into the #4 primary tube and comtinue to push it into the oil pan. This was not checked for clearance during construction, before final welding, after final welding or before supply (unfitted) and with a refusal of supplying a receipt for work done. How's that for customer-fxcking-service! :mad:

http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/4962/headers069.jpg

http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/7193/headers070.jpg

I'm a little disappointed about the more polished finish on the straight lengths of tubing. I much prefer the duller finish that the bends have. We will un-polish those sections before final welding, and they will dull when in use too.

http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/5117/headers077.jpg

67cammy

25-07-2009, 01:54 PM

Steve they look magnificent!! Are you using solid engine mounts. Just wondering about the movement of the motor under your considerable torque and how close everything is.

blackoutsteve

25-07-2009, 02:09 PM

67cammy

25-07-2009, 02:19 PM

Yes I have done the same on mine although not really needed now. At the time I intended using nitrous and I also like the look of a car rocking a bit at idle. Still have a bit of rocking courtesy of 106 degree LSA but the nitrous thing won't be happening. I'll do the same when the big block goes in too. Keep up the good work and I hope your going to take some video of this when its up and running

blackoutsteve

25-07-2009, 02:33 PM

Keep up the good work and I hope your going to take some video of this when its up and running

You can BET YOUR ARSE! :D ;)

RSZ28

26-07-2009, 08:52 AM

Still only tacked together, but this is how the driver's side is taking shape.. Only #8 to go, which will be very bendy in order to use up length.

Not much clearance between the steering components, but at least there is!

http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/4962/headers069.jpg

Tight alright! That tie rod end must only just clear on right hand turns. :eek:

blackoutsteve

26-07-2009, 10:52 AM

Only just..
I was looking at the Pitman arm and thinking what if I need to remove it..
At least the beauty of these headers with their slip fit into the collector and individual head flanges is that I can remove just one primary to gain clearance/access if need be..

Easier said than done, but these are the compromises of building race car parts into street car chassis. It's harder than building a stock street car or a dedicated race car.

blackoutsteve

27-07-2009, 03:13 PM

The #8 partially fitted.
Very hard to see in this pic the two ends where it snakes around. A 180° bend will finish this off. (Looking up from below.)

http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/504/headers082.jpg

http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/9323/headers086.jpg

Close!:p

http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/4707/headers091.jpg

blackoutsteve

29-07-2009, 07:52 PM

The #8 is now complete, so basically the headers are done as far as their layout is concerned.. Still to be fully welded -which will be the final step in the entire system as previously mentioned.

http://img194.imageshack.us/img194/9670/headers096.jpg

http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/7978/headers110.jpg

Race exhaust in street car chassis is just totally full of compromises..:rolleyes:

Right.
http://img194.imageshack.us/img194/6350/headers111.jpg

Left.
http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/7901/headers112.jpg

The headers/collectors are connected to the rest of the system using V-Band clamps. These are a one bolt clamp that clamp around two flanges mated together
No gaskets, no rusty bolts and no leaks. :) The entire center section (collectors through to axle) can be dropped out or refitted in about five minutes. ;)

http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/3600/headers116.jpg http://www.burnsstainless.com/Hardware/a_gallery_clamps.gif

This is the system in 3-1/2" diameter. Honestly, I wish I didn't have to go this big. Looks killer though. :D
It's huge in both dimension and price and will be interesting how it fits around the rear axle while crossing over with the tranverse Borlas.

http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/3481/headers099.jpg

Just big! :o

http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/3146/headers113.jpg

USA-69Z

29-07-2009, 08:04 PM

thats one hell of a big pipe you got there steve:p

Autopia

31-07-2009, 01:09 AM

Yeah, Steve's very proud of his big pipe.

Fantastic write up mate. Great to see all the progress shots and great to see and read about all the fine details.

You busy next Friday? Why don't I drag my arse over for a few beers and check the beast out in the metal.

Cheers
Sean

blackoutsteve

31-07-2009, 06:23 AM

Not sure if the car will be here by then.. Anyway, I'll give you a call SweetPants. The beer part sounds good. ;)

RSZ28

31-07-2009, 09:01 AM

Just wow! :D

18htan

31-07-2009, 09:51 AM

:eek:

That pipe is huge!

J.J.

31-07-2009, 09:52 AM

have you considered bolting some mufflers on and dumping the pipe before the diff? save you alot of hassle, will sound awesome also

Nev68

31-07-2009, 01:54 PM

Steve,
Do you still run the standard park brake set up?
How do you go for cable clearance?

tonner

31-07-2009, 02:16 PM

Hey Steve, Why 3 1/2, how much HP?

Greg

blackoutsteve

31-07-2009, 08:34 PM

have you considered bolting some mufflers on and dumping the pipe before the diff? save you alot of hassle, will sound awesome also

Nope, i don't care for the dumpers. Not that they're illegal, but I like the pipes exiting at the stock location. I'm also fitting two transverse Borlas between the axle and tank, so dumpers won't work. I need to shut the car up some. Don't worry though, it will still be loud. :D

Steve,
Do you still run the standard park brake set up?
How do you go for cable clearance?

I don't expect much clearance. I'll work it out. Probably running it over the exhaust on wear pillow blocks or something..

Hey Steve, Why 3 1/2, how much HP?

Greg

I expected to use a dual 3" as before, but the Burns Stainless program suggested 3.5". It meant more top-end power and I couldn't resist. :p

blackoutsteve

01-08-2009, 03:15 PM

The instrument carrier conversion has probably been the most tedious and frustrating part of the conversion.
Most of it worked out quite well and was relatively easy to do. Plastex was used to chemically weld the ABS plastic that the instument carrier is made out of..
Here is a shot of all the vent mounting bosses in place where the heater control once was.

http://img58.imageshack.us/img58/7834/relocatedventmount0gr.jpg

The problem came when swapping the headlamp and radio plates, so the radio would remain in the middle of the car.
(You can also see that I'm adding a factory tach (8000 rpm with 6000 redline) which is why a center fuel gauge is being fitted, and the other odd bowtie-looking cutout is for the rear window defroster. Cut out as per C50-A1 of the Factory Assembly Manual.;) :p )

http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/8233/instrumentcarriermay04s.jpg

Cutting them out and modifying them to fit in opposite locations was also easy enough, (you'd be surprised how different these two panels are in size), but what would I use to fill the gaps around them when fitted?

Superfine polyester body filler right? WRONG!:mad:

That stuff is messy as hell, very dufficult to work with at that scale, requires loads of sanding -impossible to do at that scale, and the sh!t doesn't come off with anything except abrasives.
Have you ever tried mixing a thimble load of the stuff then add what you think is 1 or 2% hardener?? That's what the whole problem was. I didn't add enough and the crap never went off. The mess it left behind was horrible to say the least.
What on Earth was I thinking???:rolleyes:

http://img58.imageshack.us/img58/133/polyesterfillerproblem0uj.jpg

Milliput 2-part epoxy to the rescue.:) This stuff is grouse. Water based, slow setting, controllable viscosty (add varying amounts of water) and available in black so no heavy painting is required. If I had have used this stuff from the start, I probably wouldn't need to paint and the end result would have better and done much sooner.

http://img54.imageshack.us/img54/6185/instrumentcarrier4.jpg

Don't mind the dust, but here is the finish. You can see the seem where this radio panel was shortened to fit. It's not at all obvious with the naked eye, but the flash pics it up well.

http://img376.imageshack.us/img376/3056/instrumentcarrier6.jpg

It's really tedious work.. I need to wear these surgical glasses to see what the hell I'm doing. :p 10X magnification. ;)

http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/8587/instrumentcarrier1.jpg

Next major work on it is to fit it to the dash in the car. Soon! :)

AUSCAMARO

01-08-2009, 03:29 PM

I really do dislike it when you update your thread whilst I'm at work Steve. I can never see the pics, I have to wait until I get home each time... How inconsiderate of you:D :D

Lucky you're write ups are full of descriptive information and I can almost picture the pictures that I can't see....:)

Mitch

blackoutsteve

01-08-2009, 03:33 PM

Hey Mitch, I just have to put the connectors in a box and head to the post office. ;)

AUSCAMARO

01-08-2009, 03:53 PM

Hey Mitch, I just have to put the connectors in a box and head to the post office. ;)

Ahh sweet!!

Tell me what I'm up for and I'll transfer it straight away.

Thanks Steve, your a champ!

Mitch

rodent

01-08-2009, 09:14 PM

Steve..........we've met, and I've followed your build thread and I have some massive respect for you and your talent and some of your equipment but...........................you sir are a nerd(respectfully speaking :D )i could picture you wearing these gogs peeling oranges or maybe during some other intimate moments(not that I've really pictured your intimate moments :) )

http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/8587/instrumentcarrier1.jpg

blackoutsteve

01-08-2009, 09:46 PM

Why?? Look at the classic Rayban Wayfarer design.. Don't you think they're cool! :cool: ("Peggy Sue.. Peggy Sue..")
:D
You know, I was almost going to snap a pic of me wearing these in the mirror, but I thought.. No, that's not a good idea. I'll let your own imagination help you out there.. :p

rodent

01-08-2009, 09:51 PM

I was almost going to snap a pic of me wearing these in the mirror, but I thought.. No, that's not a good idea.

Of course it's not a good idea.....madman :( the flash would burn your retinas to a ferkin crisp :D

Nev68

01-08-2009, 10:55 PM

Of course it's not a good idea.....madman :( the flash would burn your retinas to a ferkin crisp :D

.... and it would be hard to complete the build with raisins for eyeballs:D

Nev

rodent

02-08-2009, 09:14 AM

.... and it would be hard to complete the build with raisins for eyeballs:D

Nev

:eek: :D

blackoutsteve

05-08-2009, 05:38 PM

First pair of Borlas are on and now it's over the axle to the other pair.. That shiny section of stainless will be de-polished and will dull with normal use to match the rest of the system. This is one of the problems when dealing with unusual diameters.. Stock is bought from several suppliers as one supplier doesn't have everything, and the different suppliers also source from different places too. Consistancy is difficult, as often is supply.:rolleyes:

http://img36.imageshack.us/img36/1181/exhaust028.jpg

http://img44.imageshack.us/img44/4020/exhaust026.jpg

The other pair are 6" round Borlas and are mounted transverse between the axle & fuel tank. Believe it or not, every 1st Gen Camaro, be it stock 6cyl, V8, Dual N10, Dual NC8.. they all had mufflers mounted here. (So don't look so surprised with why I'm fitting them there! :p )
This tube will be cut where the bend ends and the muffler fitted to it. You can see how tight it is at this end of the car too. ;)

http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/5515/exhaust025.jpg

Surprisingly, this 3.5" system is tucked up very nicely. Ground clearance is better than expected. :)

http://img44.imageshack.us/img44/8333/exhaust031.jpg

RSZ28

06-08-2009, 08:41 AM

Why?? Look at the classic Rayban Wayfarer design.. Don't you think they're cool! :cool: ("Peggy Sue.. Peggy Sue..")
:D

Say yah! I think I will track a pair down and get a regular pair of correction lenses put in! :cool:

RSZ28

06-08-2009, 08:46 AM

First pair of Borlas are on and now it's over the axle to the other pair.. That shiny section of stainless will be de-polished and will dull with normal use to match the rest of the system. This is one of the problems when dealing with unusual diameters.. Stock is bought from several suppliers as one supplier doesn't have everything, and the different suppliers also source from different places too. Consistancy is difficult, as often is supply.:rolleyes:

The other pair are 6" round Borlas and are mounted transverse between the axle & fuel tank. Believe it or not, every 1st Gen Camaro, be it stock 6cyl, V8, Dual N10, Dual NC8.. they all had mufflers mounted here. (So don't look so surprised with why I'm fitting them there! :p )
This tube will be cut where the bend ends and the muffler fitted to it. You can see how tight it is at this end of the car too. ;)

Surprisingly, this 3.5" system is tucked up very nicely. Ground clearance is better than expected. :)

Looking good!

Two things:

The drive shaft loop looks like it is bolted through into the rear floor into the forward area of the seat re-inforcement. Did are the bolts thru the floor only, or did you add some additional support metal?

And........

Do you know the torque rating of the AL drive shaft?

blackoutsteve

06-08-2009, 09:27 AM

That's a steel driveshaft that's simply painted "steel".;) Camaro driveshafts were unpainted..
No idea what the torque ratings are, but someone like Moser should be able to tell you.
I intend on buying an aluminium shaft when I order my 12 Bolt. Purely for weight saving, as the steel is stronger.

The driveshaft loop does mount under the seat re-inforcement and access holes were cut to fit an anchor plates. The loop needs to be arount 6" rearward of the front uni. No, it's not the neatest install ever.:rolleyes:
I did consider drilling smaller holes and fitting crush tubes with the plates and nuts protruding on top, but then the carpet would have been pulled up by it.
At least this way, the plate and nuts are recessed and the carpet covers everything.

That's roughly a 3" x 5" x 1/4" plate with rounded edges to prevent tearing through the sheet metal in the event of a failure. Never fit an anchor plate with sharp corners, and don't rely on a few big washers. You do not want the loop getting loose with the shaft! You'll all of a sudden have two Camaros!!:p
I caulked the holes to stop moisture entering.

http://img119.imageshack.us/img119/3936/transloop001.jpg

All the fasterners are period-correct (:p) with locking nuts.

http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/6374/tailshaftloop004.jpg

http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/1716/enginein004.jpg

RSZ28

07-08-2009, 08:25 AM

Heh heh! Fooled me with the AL look on the driveshaft! :)

Asked about torque because of the lower capacity of AL. Steel is fine.

And are your "lift" bars on the rear end slapper style, or are they fastened at the front.

blackoutsteve

07-08-2009, 09:56 AM

I gues you would call them "slapper" style, but they don't push against the rear leaf at all.
They push against a steel pad that I welded onto the the side of the subframe connectors. These connectors i also made because the CE ones didn't conform to the contour of the floorpan.

http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/1590/assembly1308cl.jpg

http://img58.imageshack.us/img58/9026/misc0345mb.jpg

I don't have a good pic showing the traction bar meeting the pad, but in this pic, you can see (a lot of dust :o and) the traction bar coming in from the left. It's also pushes at a point a good 10" longer further forward than the front spring eye, because it's design, like all 4 links and ladder bars, is to push at the vehicle's CG for 100% weight transfer (in theory!:p )

http://img196.imageshack.us/img196/1377/headers084.jpg

AUSCAMARO

07-08-2009, 10:43 AM

I didn't realise how much of a kink was required!!

Thats a pretty decent angle.

Mitch

blackoutsteve

07-08-2009, 11:33 AM

Told ya!:p
Have you got them yet? Tried to fit them?

AUSCAMARO

07-08-2009, 11:54 AM

Told ya!:p
Have you got them yet? Tried to fit them?

Door bell just went and the courier just dropped them off.

Straight away the Mrs says "What have you bought of eBay now!?" :D

The boy says "is it your birthday daddy?"

Haven't looked yet as we are off to breaky so will take as squiz and report back upon my return.

Cheers Steve

AUSCAMARO

08-08-2009, 12:27 AM

WOW Steve... They are like brand new... Even got the bolts with them!

Well packaged to mate. Thankyou very much...

Mitch

454 NUTTR

16-08-2009, 06:02 PM

hi steve just looking at your build l'm doing fuel line on mine at the min and l'm going 1/2 line in to my tank as well seeing how u have gone about it l'm doing the same one thing l'm trying to find out how u sealed the fuel line u said u used jb weld, what is jb weld? and where do i get it? scott

blackoutsteve

16-08-2009, 07:06 PM

JB Weld is available at Bursons and other auto suppliers. Most hardware stores too.

It a two-part epoxy that is designed for bonding just about anything, especially metal..

What is your fuel line made out of?
Another alternative is stainless tubing that can be welded to the flange, an alum flange (easy to make) that can be welded to alum line or copper tubing that can be braized.

JB Weld is fuel resistant, but until I use it an do miles with the car, I can't really comment on it being the best solution/option. If it ever fails, I will end up doing one of the above. Hopefully not. ;)

454 NUTTR

16-08-2009, 07:25 PM

mine's alum might give the jb weld a go not a big job to pull out the tank if it go's to sh#t thanks

blackoutsteve

16-08-2009, 07:27 PM

http://jbweld.net/index.php

cluxford

17-08-2009, 08:43 AM

Hey Steve, when is your car going to be back on the road, do you have a timeline in mind ?

blackoutsteve

17-08-2009, 09:01 AM

Yes I do.. Hopefully around 2005. :p

TUFF68

17-08-2009, 11:57 AM

A solid mount of the left side, and an OE rubber mount on the right.
The left side is in tension to the torque reaction and I'd constantly tear them in half. The right side is in compression, so an OE is fine there..
Also it will help absorb some of the vibration. :)
Hey Steve, do you have any pics of your solid engine mount on the left side ? I'm in the process of doing the same. Thanks :)

blackoutsteve

17-08-2009, 04:02 PM

This is it here.. It's a Moroso mount.. I can get the part number for you if you want because there are a few to choose from.. I still have the other (sold in pairs) but I think I'm gonna keep it.

http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/7605/engineblackout1050ly.jpg (http://img209.imageshack.us/i/engineblackout1050ly.jpg/)

http://img490.imageshack.us/img490/5051/engineblackout0220fn.jpg (http://img490.imageshack.us/i/engineblackout0220fn.jpg/)

TUFF68

17-08-2009, 04:45 PM

Yeah a part number would be good thanks Steve. I was actually a little surprised that it is a bought one, was expecting you to say you made it :p :D

No need for the part number Steve, found the info on the Moroso website

blackoutsteve

17-08-2009, 07:56 PM

You know, I was going to, but I thought folding & cutting 1/4" steel as neatly as I could would end up inaccurate. A lot of stuffing around for one mount..
It was just easier to just buy them seeing that they're already on the shelf. ;)

blackoutsteve

18-08-2009, 10:00 PM

This is where the tips will exit, but they still need to have about a 30° cut, probably parallel with the lower edge of the 1/4 panel or the tank. As you can see, 90° never looks good.

http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/8028/exhaust043.jpg

Here is why I used oval tubing. There was no way in hell a 3-1/2" diameter was going to fit through here!
3-1/2" oval tubing is 2-3/8" x 4-1/8", so the fit is actually easier than 2-1/2" tailpipes!

http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/2369/exhaust050.jpg

Still another muffler to go. John says fitting two 3-1/2" tubes though here is actually harder than making either of the two headers!

http://img38.imageshack.us/img38/998/exhaust045.jpg

The 2nd muffler will hang low, but only as low as the OE systems originally did.

http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/5973/exhaust052.jpg

...as John demonstrates.. Note that this is still higher than the lowest point of the diff housing..

http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/7813/exhaust036.jpg

To compare, here is a pic of an OE chambered exhaust. Heights are almost identical.

http://img36.imageshack.us/img36/3008/053zde.jpg

Nearly done! :D

67SS502

18-08-2009, 10:15 PM

You are a legend steve everything you have done on this car has been 100% perfect, except for one thing you need a Moser 12 bolt hahahahaha

blackoutsteve

18-08-2009, 10:25 PM

Soon, my friend..soon.. ;)

blackoutsteve

20-08-2009, 08:40 PM

The left rear hanger is not connected which is why it's hanging unevenly, but it's now ready to remove to weld up the entire system and fit the bungs and stuff. Once refitted, it's home time. :D

http://img188.imageshack.us/img188/7207/exhaust061.jpg

Tight!

http://img229.imageshack.us/img229/6274/exhaust054.jpg

http://img188.imageshack.us/img188/9917/exhaust056.jpg

WILD68

20-08-2009, 10:53 PM

Are you gonna drive it home steve???

blackoutsteve

21-08-2009, 06:10 AM

It's still a while off driving.. I'll use a tandem.;)

Nev68

21-08-2009, 02:07 PM

Steve,
It looks like a tight fit, but at least it fits.
What's the dimension of the tail pipe?

blackoutsteve

21-08-2009, 05:37 PM

The 3-1/2" oval tubing is 2-3/8" x 4-1/8". There is no volume lost so they don't hurt flow.;)
They just hurt your pocket.. They're pricey.

cluxford

21-08-2009, 05:45 PM

Steve, who did em. I have been seriously thinking about these.

My car will be going off for exhaust in about 4 weeks to Rowville exhausts. I have a quote in the $5.5K range for headers in mild steel (will be ceramic coated) and 3" stainless system

But as my car will be sitting on the deck I am seriously considering ovals

blackoutsteve

21-08-2009, 07:10 PM

The tubing is from BurnsStainless..

http://www.burnsstainless.com/OvalTubing/ovaltubing.html

Which ceramic coating? As in, the 1300F or the 2000F stuff?
I strongly recomend the 2000F stuff, but then, I recomend putting that money towards stainless steel for headers that will last forever.
I had HPC's regular 1300F coating and it burnt off in several places. Go figure. Exhaust temps are 1300F so it's already at it's temp limit.
If the stuff can't handle a burnout, chassis dyno run or running a cam in, forget it. I wasn't about to waste my money on that stuff again.

http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/7104/burntcoating.th.jpg (http://img20.imageshack.us/i/burntcoating.jpg/) http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/3477/exhaust009xd3.th.jpg (http://img212.imageshack.us/my.php?image=exhaust009xd3.jpg)

Nev68

21-08-2009, 07:27 PM

The 3-1/2" oval tubing is 2-3/8" x 4-1/8". There is no volume lost so they don't hurt flow.;)
They just hurt your pocket.. They're pricey.

Where's the last hanging point mounted to?

blackoutsteve

21-08-2009, 07:30 PM

Did you see the OE hangers I modified?

http://www.usmuscle.com.au/Forum/showpost.php?p=16091&postcount=121

blackoutsteve

21-08-2009, 07:40 PM

Only Camaros with factory dual exhaust systems had two hangers. These are generally only Z28s SS, & COPOs. Very few others, including most V8s, actually had a dual exhaust.
Otherwise, they only had a hanger on the right side. Also, there were no provisions for a left hanger. A steel plate needed to be welded in as a mounting point which is what I have done too.

This is just in case you're looking on the left rail of your Camaro for the threaded holes. Good chance you won't find them. (If you do with the plate, please, let me know.)

Scroll down to "Dual exhaust".. (I just love how they used a pic showing how some banana welded the wrong bracket to the chassis rail with the correct mount RIGHT THERE!.. Great example -not.:p )
http://www.camaros.org/options.shtml#id

blackoutsteve

03-09-2009, 08:40 PM

It's all welded up and ready to re-fit.. :)

Pics!

http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/2645/exhaust073.jpg

http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/5159/exhaust074.jpg

http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/1461/exhaust076.jpg

http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/64/exhaust067.jpg

http://img268.imageshack.us/img268/8046/exhaust065.jpg

http://img268.imageshack.us/img268/3919/exhaust064.jpg

rodent

03-09-2009, 09:23 PM

Sexy :cool:

USA-69Z

03-09-2009, 10:09 PM

yes that is a nice length pipe you got Steve:o

rodent

03-09-2009, 10:20 PM

yes that is a nice length pipe you got Steve:o

:eek: http://www.yellowbullet.com/forum/images/smilies/gay.gif :D

blackoutsteve

03-09-2009, 10:23 PM

Don't forget about the girth.. That matters just as much. :p

USA-69Z

03-09-2009, 10:23 PM

:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

69SS

04-09-2009, 01:03 AM

Whoa that is some heavy hitting hardware mate, wont have any probs breathing with that set up... But its not the size of the pipe that matters, its what ya do with it :)

RSZ28

25-10-2009, 11:37 PM

Hey Steve, how's the project moving along mate?

I thought there was a picture which showed this in your thread, but I could not find it, so obviously I was imagining it.

Was wondering if you knew which way around the mono leaves go?

Not immediately obvious, but there is a very large radius curve on one side of the spring where it necks down from the front and rear to go through the spring perch.

Do you know if this radius faces the outside of the car, or toward the centre?

I just found my RHS spring is 20% thinner than the LHS spring, plus is around 15mm longer from the spring eye to the axle centre, so time to get them right with some spares I have, and want to make sure they go in right.

Thanks mate. :)

blackoutsteve

31-10-2009, 10:17 AM

blackoutsteve

31-10-2009, 03:15 PM

The exhaust... Boy, this sure is dragging on.:rolleyes:
I won't go into details but let's just say whenever other people get involved, there is ALWAYS problems..
For the money I have spent, I sure feel the service was far from acceptable regarding certain issues that are yet to be resolved

Anyway.. :D

I bought myself some 316 stainless wire and Argon shielding gas and I'm fixing it myself along with adding a few features such as heat sheilding.

This stuff (TF600 I'm using) http://www.dci.com.au/performance is available from Bursons and you can easily cut and mould it into shape.

http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/4610/heatsheilds001.jpg

http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/8507/heatsheilds003.jpg

http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/5672/heatsheilds004.jpg

The easiest way to buy 1/4" 304SS rod.. Cut into 3/8" lengths and welded in place.

http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/6976/heatsheilds009.jpg

http://img97.imageshack.us/img97/614/heatsheilds012.jpg

1/4" shaft clips..

http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/2088/heatsheilds008.jpg

Punch 1/4" holes in the sheild with a hollow punch and...

http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/2568/heatsheilds014.jpg

http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/9026/heatsheilds015.jpg

From under the car.. Invisable. ;)

http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/1324/heatsheilds018.jpg

Some of the tubing will need to be done in areas where it's close to the floor..
Stay tuned.:cool:

blackoutsteve

01-11-2009, 09:22 PM

I was going to do more heat sheilding, but decided not to.. For now anyway..
I added just these two pieces where the exhaust run very close to the floor. These should reduce the heat by a fair bit.

http://img513.imageshack.us/img513/2618/heatsheilds019.jpg

This is what you'll see from inder the car which is good, because the sheilding is real ugly in my opinion.

http://img513.imageshack.us/img513/8290/heatsheilds021.jpg

blackoutsteve

01-11-2009, 09:44 PM

One of the primaries of the system interfered with the steering, which considering the price I paid and the self-proclaimed expertise, I found that pretty damn lousy. Not only did the tierod touch the primary, it pushed it into the oil pan which was a 1/4" away :rolleyes:
After all the months of waiting and rooting around, and trying to get this system finished, I decided to re-make the offending primary my-damn-self.

This is the tierod pushing the primary into the oil pan at full lock. :o Seriously, you would think that's a pretty important thing to check before welding, huh?.
http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/7474/exhaust087.jpg

My first effort at making an exhaust primary. I'm real careful not to "cheat" the bends when cutting. You need to vision where the tubing goes really well. It took me quite a while to imagine the new route this primary would take before I made the first cut.
This primary needs to clear the swing of both the Pitman arm and tierod. It's the #4.

http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/2778/newprimary007.jpg

Almost finished with the offending section below.

http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/9168/newprimary008.jpg

Yet to be welded up, but at least it now clears the tierod and the Pitman at full lock.. :D

http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/8919/newprimary013.jpg

http://img515.imageshack.us/img515/373/newprimary015.jpg

Getting there. ..slowly! :( :)
http://img515.imageshack.us/img515/8264/newprimary011.jpg

USA-69Z

01-11-2009, 10:41 PM

she's tight alright... did the so called 'exhaust specialist' know this happened?? what was the reaction?

69SS

01-11-2009, 11:00 PM

Nice work Steve, I bet you would have been "less" than impressed with primary debacle! I would have been spewin mate, sorry to here about this.

blackoutsteve

02-11-2009, 01:21 AM

He was made aware of it and did intend to rectify. However.. apart from being so easily preventable in stuffing me around by simply checking it in the first place, issues regarding his workplace arose and that delayed things..
I just got sick to death of waiting. Work began on this system in June! We're in November now, over $10K later in materials, components, labor and it's still not finished.
Credit where it's due, he made an excellent system overall. But the simple mistakes and it's inconvience on me has made it hard to justify his expense.

RSZ28

02-11-2009, 06:48 AM

Sorry for the late reply :p
Are they both the same brand? Is one a replacement? Did you get it sorted?

Thanks for the reply Steve. No worries mate. Life's like that.

One spring is certainly different from the other being 20% thinner and the locator spigot is 15-20mm further back similar to a couple spares I have. (Makes rear end a little kock eyed, gotta get that right.) Though the spares aren't longer like the thin spring. Possibly they are Firebird springs or vice versa and Pontiac rears used slightly different springs as far as rear end positioning went.

The spares I have are GM springs, but the part number looks to be 67 (earlier number than 68) and I cant find any tables anywhere like the 68 Assembly Manual readouts.

Who knows what has been swapped in and out in 40+ years. :eek:

Your exhaust looks fantastic even with the problems you have. Almost has me convinced to rebuild mine in stainless once I make a higher rear x member. Mild steel at present painted heatproof black.

Thought that pipe looked a bit close in one of your earlier pics. :(

69coupe

02-11-2009, 08:23 AM

over $10K later in materials, components, labor and it's still not finished.
QUOTE]

:eek: :eek: :eek:
Steve
10K Just on the exhaust :confused: :confused:

AUSCAMARO

04-11-2009, 11:13 PM

Time for a new emoticon....
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/images/smilies/mad0233.gif

blackoutsteve

08-11-2009, 05:10 PM

I got the new primary TIG welded and it fitted very nicely with clearance of the Pitman and the tierod. Yay!

http://img43.imageshack.us/img43/7692/newprimary.jpg

The center section of the system was next. (Another oversight by the banana who built the system.) It also required cutting and re-welding in a couple of places as it was touching the floor.
Hopefully, after 5-6 months of f-ing around, I'm hoping this is the system installed now.

Not a great pic here is how close the system is to the fuel pump. I thought it wise to fit a heat shield here. I also need to grab some more Fire-Sleeve for the fuel line too. I once lost a race to a Lamborghini thanks to vaporlock.
Never again!!:p

http://img197.imageshack.us/img197/8950/heatshield009.jpg

..and here where #8 is close to the firewall.

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/3231/heatshield010.jpg

blackoutsteve

08-11-2009, 05:41 PM

I made up some 3/8" transmission cooler lines out of aluminium bundy and need a clip to support the lines as they pass over the crossmember.

This is close to what I want, but is only good for ~1/4" lines. (That's a piece of 3/8" line. -too big.) Dual 3/8" diameter clips aren't available like this -that I'm aware of (..and I'm not using those bling billet aluminium clips :p).

http://img687.imageshack.us/img687/4240/transcoolerclip001.jpg

Cut..

http://img43.imageshack.us/img43/6973/transcoolerclip002.jpg

Bend..

http://img43.imageshack.us/img43/8130/transcoolerclip003.jpg

..and make dies. Welded two 3/8" bolt shanks together with a spacer and welded two pieces of steel to some angleline to form the clip around the bolts.

http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/7292/transcoolerclip004.jpg

Stick it in the vice and...

http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/7936/transcoolerclip005.th.jpg (http://img263.imageshack.us/my.php?image=transcoolerclip005.jpg) http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/3177/transcoolerclip006.th.jpg (http://img263.imageshack.us/my.php?image=transcoolerclip006.jpg) http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/907/transcoolerclip007.th.jpg (http://img263.imageshack.us/my.php?image=transcoolerclip007.jpg)

Looks good but obviously too tight, and I didn't sit it in the die properly..

http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/9662/transcoolerclip009.jpg

A little massaging of the die and try again.. Looking good! :D

http://img509.imageshack.us/img509/497/transcoolerclip012.jpg

A few choice bends and a hole!

http://img509.imageshack.us/img509/5318/transcoolerclip016.jpg

A thorough coat of silver gal and a top coat of OEM's Phosphate grey. Yes, this is the US$60 a can stuff. :eek:

http://img200.imageshack.us/img200/4608/transcoolerclip018.jpg

There it is!.. In the middle of the pic.. Down there fastened to the lower frame bracket bolt.. Wow, it looks totally OE!! :)
Now, who gives a rat's arse? :D

http://img194.imageshack.us/img194/2716/transcoolerclip024.jpg

Damn dust..

http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/1240/transcoolerclip026.jpg